General Season 6 Spoilers - Part 6 - The Bermuda Triangle

[AutumnT]

Oh look TV tome just scams from posted spoilers no matter how vague they are. LOL.

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Autumn

I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.

[tyche]

I have no idea if this link to a Marti video interview contains spoilers or not, so I'm putting it here just in case:

quote:

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Video Interview: Marti Noxon
"Buffy" Co-creator Goes On Camera

http://www.13thstreet.com/site/common/v ... d=d9335-d0 119-feab5-c89b1" target="_blank">here

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[My note: try copy/pasting the link if this version doesn't work.]
[This message has been edited by tyche (edited February 26, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by tyche (edited February 26, 2002).]

[This message has been edited by xita (edited February 26, 2002).]quote:

[Beatie]

Blerk

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Beatie :^D
Keeper of Willow's Magic Addiction
Mother of Willow Intervention

[Verbena]

Oh, come on ! What's with this "4th one's the charm" clue ? We all know that Prue (4 letters, a "Charmed" one) died way long ago ! But maybe Wanda gets her spoilers from another TVshow old episode...

Ok, this was me being meany. Going back to the Lurking abysses now, and shuting my mouth before puting my foot in it...

Editing because I don't know how to write "lurking"...

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Do not mock small blonde women like me. They may be Gods.

[This message has been edited by Verbena (edited February 26, 2002).]

[willowtarasandwich]

As a relative newcomer to this board, I am still a little confused as to the authenticity of the "BSD" rumours that keep resurfacing, like in the 'blerk' bit before.

Can anybody answer me a few questions, please? (apologies if they have been answered before, but I've had a quick scan through this topic and not picked up everything on the subject)

1. When did the BSD rumour begin? And where did it come from?

2. How reliable is the source now / how reliable has it been in the past (I saw something about Wanda prediciting the outcome of season 5, but when did she predict it and how close to the truth was her prediction?

3. Has there been any comment, official or unofficial from Joss, or any of the writers?

4. It has been said that all of the regulars are signed up for season 7 - is that definite, or just taken as 'they all signed long term contracts when they started'

5. Where do the spoilers for future episodes come from - for instance, they seem remarkably detailed for ep 16, 17 and 18 - is there a leak on the set?

6. And finally, if the later episodes in the series haven't even been written yet, let alone filmed, how can anyone know what is going to happen - I wouildn't be surprised if the rumours were actually let slip by the likes of Joss to 'test out' public reaction before committing to a story line

7. And really finally - any date yet for shooting of the last 4 episodes?

[Epicurus]

Can we just classify this new particular Wanda spoiler under the "Insubstantial and illegitimate BSD spoiler" category?

quote:

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Originally posted by willowtarasandwich:
2. How reliable is the source now / how reliable has it been in the past (I saw something about Wanda prediciting the outcome of season 5, but when did she predict it and how close to the truth was her prediction?

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My advice:
Don't believe what Wanda says.
Unless you live with a desire to have Seth Green back on BTVS then, well, she'll give you all the hope you need.

Wanda might know a bit here and there but it is usually information that other Internet spoiler suppliers have already shared so it leaves her rather redundant and annoying.
quote:

[Queen of Denial]

1. When did the BSD rumour begin? And where did it come from?

i think it first made it's appearance in Mr. Do-not-defy-me's spoilers about the upcoming season which came out prior to the start of the 6th season. Herc came out with a sort of summary of each episode of season 6 and for awhile, his spoilers were accurate but as the season went on, the spoilers he first came out with were further and further from the truth but since he was right for the first couple of times, people still insist the BSD is true.

2. How reliable is the source now / how reliable has it been in the past (I saw something about Wanda predicting the outcome of season 5, but when did she predict it and how close to the truth was her prediction?
he was very reliable before but i don't trust him now eversince he kept harking on about tara being the BSD. (i'm biased that way)

3. Has there been any comment, official or unofficial from Joss, or any of the writers?
joss and marti have said on many occasions that amber isn't going anywhere. If i recall correctly, no official source has ever said that their will even be a death. i leave it to others to provide the links to said articles/quotes

4. It has been said that all of the regulars are signed up for season 7 - is that definite, or just taken as 'they all signed long term contracts when they started'

from what i know, the core scoobies were all signed for seven seasons at the start. it's the seasons after that are iffy.

5. Where do the spoilers for future episodes come from - for instance, they seem remarkably detailed for ep 16, 17 and 18 - is there a leak on the set?

most of the accurate spoilers come from casting sides (parts of the script sent to casting agencies) that are used to audition actors for bit roles in each episode. Other accurate spoilers come from location shoot visits by very intrepid kitten board members.

6. And finally, if the later episodes in the series haven't even been written yet, let alone filmed, how can anyone know what is going to happen - I wouildn't be surprised if the rumours were actually let slip by the likes of Joss to 'test out' public reaction before committing to a story line

that's just it. anybody who claims they know even before the script is written is probably pulling your leg. i don't think joss is the type to test out public reactions. he pretty much has his idea of how the show shuold go and does it.

7. And really finally - any date yet for shooting of the last 4 episodes?

nope.no accurate news just yet. i think they're just breaking the 21st episode based on a post on the bronze beta by steve deknight.
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dunno if i answered evrything correctly. if i didn't i'm sure somebody will jump in and correct me.

ches

edited to correct typos.

TARA LIVES!

[This message has been edited by Queen of Denial (edited February 26, 2002).]

[willowtarasandwich]

Thanks for the detailed replies - much appreciated

[tommo]

I'm still grasping with strong lesbian fingers to the apparently far-fetched notion that hey, Willow and Tara really love one another and woo! Tara might just take Willow back because they're committed to making their relationship better. And wow! could it just be possible that their relationship is going to last and neither of them will die, kill one another, kill anyone else or end up, against all the odds, as a happy, fulfilled lesbian couple?

Stranger things have happened.

Eh...I just get pissy about the whole Tara dies shit. Cuz that's what it is. She's not going to die; she's not going to leave; she's not going anywhere. Except for climbing into a large bed with Willow where the two of them will have an in depth reconciliation.

Sigh.

And if I'm wrong, I will walk naked around the block wearing a huge sign that says "I am Queen Wrong of Wrongonia".

Humph.

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Sweetie...I'm a fag.

[drlloyd11]

quote:

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Originally posted by willowtarasandwich:
1. When did the BSD rumour begin? And where did it come from?

-From Herc, and then Wanda. The first "confirmed BSD" was Tara came from Wendy who has since retracted. This rumours had Tara dying in the first week of january. Two others sources also are around, all apearing around december 1st. The source of these leaks has been determined and discreditied.

2.How reliable is the source now / how reliable has it been in the past (I saw something about Wanda prediciting the outcome of season 5, but when did she predict it and how close to the truth was her prediction?

Wanda had a set visit. They *gave* her those spoilers for publicity.

3. Has there been any comment, official or unofficial from Joss, or any of the writers?

Steve deKnight said she will only die over "his dead body".

4. It has been said that all of the regulars are signed up for season 7 - is that definite, or just taken as 'they all signed long term contracts when they started'

They all have long terms.

5. Where do the spoilers for future episodes come from - for instance, they seem remarkably detailed for ep 16, 17 and 18 - is there a leak on the set?

yep!

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[This message has been edited by WillTara (edited February 26, 2002).]quote:

[tommo]

quote:

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Originally posted by willowtarasandwich:
Thanks for the detailed replies - much appreciated

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Nice name, btw.

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Sweetie...I'm a fag.quote:

[AutumnT]

Figuring out when they are shooting episodes is just simple math. It takes 8 days of first unit work to shoot an episode and sometimes up to 8 days of second unit. Second unit does inserts and establishing shots and closeups of hands doing things, and any first unit work that could not be fit in. So we are really mostly concerned with first unit. We know, for instance, that episode 18 started shooting Feb 11th and 19 around the 22nd. So start adding 8 days (not weekends) on to the 22nd and it's pretty easy to figure out just what episode is being filmed.

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Autumn

I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.

[tommo]

Wow, Autumn. So logical. The force is strong in you.

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Sweetie...I'm a fag.

[willowtarasandwich]

I thought for a long time about the name, Tommo, and thought it summed up appropriately the position I would like to be in!

But thanks to you all for your explanations - as I said, much appreciated, and a little less concerned now.

[Magikcat]

NO ONE IS GOING TO DIE!!!!!!!
BTW what happened to miss kitty fantastic?

Willow and Tara Always.

[AutumnT]

quote:

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Originally posted by tommo:
Wow, Autumn. So logical. The force is strong in you

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Ah yes, and perhaps for my next television production 101 lecture I will address why it is foolish to assume that something not written by a staff writer is a one off or alternate universe type of episode as I see that assumption a lot by folks that do not know the inner workings of the writer's guild union and how production companies get around their requirements in a sneaky manner. If anyone is interested that is.

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Autumn

I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.quote:

[BBOvenGuy]

quote:

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Originally posted by Queen of Denial:
i think it first made it's appearance in Mr. Do-not-defy-me's spoilers about the upcoming season which came out prior to the start of the 6th season. Herc came out with a sort of summary of each episode of season 6 and for awhile, his spoilers were accurate but as the season went on, the spoilers he first came out with were further and further from the truth but since he was right for the first couple of times, people still insist the BSD is true.

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Our dear friend Wendy of The Spoiler Zone also started posting Big Scooby Death rumors, and she even went so far as to say it would be Tara and she would die during the February Sweeps. After retracting that spoiler, she is now trying to say that since the "Buffy can't tell reality from illusion" storyline was postponed to Episode 17, maybe Tara's death has been postponed to later in the season as well. Naturally, she offers no evidence to back up her claim. She never has.

quote:

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joss and marti have said on many occasions that amber isn't going anywhere. If i recall correctly, no official source has ever said that their will even be a death. i leave it to others to provide the links to said articles/quotes

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Marti has said "There will be death," but when it comes to Buffy that's about as much of a spoiler as saying, "There will be commercials." Certainly we will see characters die by the end of the season. That doesn't mean they're going to be the main characters of the series. There has been absolutely nothing in the way of evidence that any of the main Scoobies are about to be killed off.

quote:

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from what i know, the core scoobies were all signed for seven seasons at the start. it's the seasons after that are iffy.

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Everyone is already signed through next year, except for Amber Benson. That's one of the big reasons why people assume Tara's going to be the one who gets killed off. However, Amber has never had a contract that extended beyond the season she was working at the time, and she's been back every year so far. There's really no reason to think that things are any different now. Marti Noxon has pretty much said that in a number of different interviews.

quote:

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Other accurate spoilers come from location shoot visits by very intrepid kitten board members.

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When we can find out about them, yes. Did y'all see my post from yesterday about the limited return of the Shoot Sheet?

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Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)quote:quote:quote:quote:

[Kris]

AutumnT- why do they have to have non-regs write some eps? I've always wondered that...

[GODisTigger]

quote:

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Originally posted by BBOvenGuy:
Everyone is already signed through next year, except for Amber Benson. That's one of the big reasons why people assume Tara's going to be the one who gets killed off.

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To me that makes it just too glaringly obvious that it'd be her.

Hmm, someone is supposed to die? Let's look for the one without an extended contract, it MUST be that one. Talk about killing the suspense.

At least, that's how I see it.

D
quote:

[bzengo]

quote:

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Originally posted by AutumnT:
Ah yes, and perhaps for my next television production 101 lecture I will address why it is foolish to assume that something not written by a staff writer is a one off or alternate universe type of episode as I see that assumption a lot by folks that do not know the inner workings of the writer's guild union and how production companies get around their requirements in a sneaky manner. If anyone is interested that is.

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Um, excuse me. Is this Televison Production 101? With Dr. Professor AutumnT?

bzengo sits down in the third row over on the left hand side, takes out a black ink pen and yellow legal pad, and waits patiently for the lecture to begin.

I'm interested. Lecture please.

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bzengo

Willow "Prince of Night, I summon you! Come fill me with your black, naughty evil!"

Joss (Sun Aug 30, 1998)
". . . Sooooo, someone is hoping this season will be less traumatic? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!"quote:

[BBOvenGuy]

I'm not completely sure, but my guess is that Autumn is referring to the process any TV script goes through, where it is taken apart and put back together any number of different ways by any number of "Producers" who are really writers with Producer titles. The show that actually gets on the air rarely looks very much like the script you originally wrote, even if your name is the one on the "Written by" credit.

Thus even a script supposedly written by a non-staff writer can have very crucial season-arc elements in it. It's not necessarily a stand-alone or alternate-universe episode.

This, by the way, is why I ended up quitting my quest for a Hollywood writing gig and am now working on books instead.

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Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)

[AutumnT]

AutumnT approaches the lecturn

Ahem. When producing a television series there are certain requirements made upon you by the various professional guilds that you work with. The writer's guild, in order to get more writers working, asks that some scripts be provided to a series by folks that are not currently a writer on staff with the production company. This is easier to do with some shows than with others. So, this is where the sneaky part comes in as far as meeting the letter of the rule, but not necessarily the spirit of which it was intended. What often happens is that the production company has another staffer with writing talent "write" the episode. In the case of the X-Files which was notorious for doing this, they used a director, the special effects guy, a propsmaster, and actors. Some of the scripts were, of course, better than others. Some were very heavily or almost completely rewritten (as in the case of the props guys) by the showrunner and yet the props guy was given full credit as the writer of the episode and paid for it making the writer's guild happy.

I don't know as much about the outside writers on Buffy, but I do find it interesting that the Normal Again writer is a former assistant on the show. What would not surprise me is that these outside scripts are probably still either very sheparded or rewritten so that they fit in with exactly where the show is going. As I recall Buffy brought in Howard Gordon (who was an early XF writer and pal of Greenwalt) as a consulting producer for a while and let him share a writing credit with Marti on an episode. That's another way of doing it. That's all we saw of Howard on Buffy. And the episode was the first part of an important 2-parter not some one off. Another way of doing things is to use a script from a writer you're going to hire full time the next season anyway. Fury's first script for ME was "Go Fish" - one of the last episodes of season 2. Anyway, that's the behind the scenes stuff that goes on and why I never think alternate universe automatically. I don't know how much goes on with Buffy, but I do know uncredited rewrites are very very common in the industry.

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Autumn

I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.

[BBOvenGuy]

Wow, the production companies are even sneakier than I gave them credit for.

This thing from the Guild is only a recommendation, yes? It's not a requirement? Because if it's a requirement, then how did J. Michael Straczynski get away with writing two entire seasons of Babylon 5 single handed? Perhaps it's something that has come along since B5 went off the air...

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Remember the Kitten Board Mantra: "Joss is nuts about Tara, Willow/Tara and Amber!"
(...and Marti's rather fond of them, too...)

[AutumnT]

The rules may be different for syndicated vs network TV, but I did hear from a writing staffer on a network 1 hour drama that they were required to use 2 outside scripts a year. West Wing is also very sneaky about this since everyone pretty much knows the creator writes or rewrites heavily all the episodes, but they dole out joint written by credits to get around it.

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Autumn

I have the sudden urge to dedicate my productive cooperation.

[Still Waters Run Deep]

Just as an aside, but still within this writing thread, I seem to remember something about Amber having a go at doing some writing for BtVs, or was it wishful thinking on our part?

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Still Waters Run Deep

*Hands! Hands in new places!*

[BBOvenGuy]

Wishful thinking on our part, I'm afraid, sparked by Amber's work on the Buffy comic. I still think if any of the regulars are going to take a swing at something behind the camera, Amber would be the one to do it - but there's no sign that she's about to.

[PJ]

When Buffy (and many other shows)has a non staff writer write an episode, they bring that person in ahead of time and he breaks the episode with the rest of the writers exactly as if he was a member of the staff. The process of writing the episode is the same as if the guest was a member of staff. They all break the episode together, the writer submits a 14 page outline for review and then writes the first draft. So, while it is an outside writer, it is hard to call it an outside script.
Other tidbits. The original cast all signed 5 year contracts which were renegotiated halfway through increasing the original pay amounts and also extending them 2 additional years. It's a tradeoff, if the actor is willing to sign for more years, he gets his current as well as future salary increased. It has been suggested that SMG may have renegotiated twice. James signed a two year contract for seasons 4 and 5. Emma signed a contract through season 6 as I recall being reported by variety in the spring of 2000. Since James is still here and Mutant Enemy has said all the regulars are signed through season 7, we must assume that James and Emma have been extended through season 7.

[sam7777]

One of the writers (Steven DeKnight) said that they are in the midst of filming Episode 19 and breaking the story for 21. The season has 22 eps and still no info on a BSD. Tara is alive at the end of the
wedding ep and a scene with her and Willow has been posted here for ep 18 that
jibes with spoilers for ep. Tara is rumored to appear in ep 19 (the actress was seen on the set). I'm guessing that Tara will appear in eps 16,18,19 and 21 (completing the 16 eps that the actress is contracted for). The writer for episode 21 is Marti Noxon and she has said that she wants to do a romantic scene with Willow and Tara that does not involve magic or singing. I think that ep 19 is when Tara and Willow will reconcile.

Joss Whedon is not slated to write another episode this season. I'd think that if a major character is going to die that he would write the episode (he wrote both the episodes where Buffy and Joyce died last season).

[Wiccagrrl]

Small problem with that theory. We pretty much know that she'll be in ep 17. (She and Willow supposedly save each other) And I just can't see her NOT being in the final ep of the season (ep 22)So, perhaps she'll be in more than her scheduled 16.

[supermus]

Good idea Wiccagrrl! Last year they gave her 18 instead of 16. If she's in 16,17,18,19,21,22, then that would be 18 eps(1-10,13,14,above.)