sorta OT: great books by women, or with great female charact

[lion + dove]

okay, i'm guessing i'm not the only one in this situation:

having received gift certificates/money for the holidays, am now (or soon will be) looking to invest in some books and music (seeift certificate) that hopefully i will still be glad i got for years to come.

i know we've had topics before about good lesbian/bi/questioning, etc. lit- but i was wondering if we could expand on that to books by either kick-ass femmes or with amazing female characters...

that and perhaps offer a refresher course for those still looking for quality gifts for others, or something for themselves afterwards....

all genres and ages welcome. and hell even male characters to make it not so elitist- err i mean sexist *laughs* sorry about that.

for reference, some books I've read/own and/or am devoted to by female authors (I'm trying to read the "classics"):

All books Austen (personally recommend the big 'un Pride&Prejudice and Persuasion- avoid Mansfield Park the book (movie's better) if you don't want to be upset by Jane writing a significantly less strong/developed female character)
All things Eudora Welty
Edith Wharton (Age of Innocence and The House of Mirth)
George Eliot (reading Middlemarch right now)
Virginia Woolf
Dorothy Parker (though I like her personally more than any of her characters)
Edna Farber (another Algonquin woman- So Big and Giant)
Carson McCullers
Kate Chopin's The Awakening

noted holes:
Plath and Stein (not a big poetry reader)
Willa Cather (only read a few of her short stories)
Iris Murdoch

this all started (well reached a fever pitch) when my dad and i got into a lasting argument about whether they had been any great female authors. so i set out to read as many female writers (especially older female writers) as i could. and now i only give female authors as gifts to my friends.

forgot subset question:

who is your favorite female book character of all time?

don't shy away from children's books characters either. i've often thought that if i had a band i'd be tempted to name it The Bess/George Complex. feel free to steal this band name, as i will almost assuredly never be in a band. but do at least give some small print credit please *laughs*

[This message has been edited by WillTara (edited December 16, 2001).]

[La]

How about authors of children's books? L.J. Smith (that would be Lisa Jane) writes(or wrote, I don't think she's written a new one in a few years) books with supernatural themes with strong female characters. They're more "young adult" books than childrens books. She wrote 3 different trilogies (one about witches: The Secret Circle, one about Vampires: The Vampire Diaries, and one about ESP-type powers: Dark Visions) and then there's her Night World series (a secret society of witches, vampires, and shapeshifters with rules and government, etc). I read most of her stuff when I was in junior high and it's probably most appropriate for that age group, but of course, Harry Potter's written for that age group and everyone enjoys that, so hey ... The Secret Circle books really piqued my interest in Wicca and Paganism.

[JodiMnstr]

I've long been an avid SciFi/Fantasy reader who primarily sought out female authors/protaganists. Here's some ideas for you in that vein:

Fantasy:
The Deeds of Paksennarion by Elizabeth Moon (These can be found as either 3 individual books starting with The Sheepfarmer's Daughter, or I think there's a single volume that contains all 3. Set in a Tolkein like world, this is the story of a woman who starts out as a mercenary soldier and her journey to becoming a paladin. Great Stuff!)

Practically anything by Mercedes Lackey, but especially the Oath series and the Heralds of Valdemar series.

Anne McCaffrey is another author who tends to have strong female characters. Dragonriders of Pern series and the Crystal Singer series are good to start with.

Jennifer Roberson has her Sword Singer series which definitely has a strong sword weilding female lead.

Marion Zimmer Bradley is another author with great female characters. Check out her Free Amazons in the Darkover series. Also, she edited a series of books called Sword and Sorceress which have great stories with female leads by many different authors. If you can find the compilation of Lythande tales from the Thieves World series, this is a great character as well.

If you want light fare check out the Chicks in Chainmail series, which are humorous tales of swordswomen.

Science Fiction:
The Honor Harrington Series by David Weber is one that I can't recommend more highly. Honor is a fantastic character who kicks butt and takes names. And she has a great companion in Nimitz, her empathic treecat.

Another area to explore are the Uber Xena/Gabrielle tales that have been published. Some of these include Missy Good's Tropical Storm, Lucifer Rising by Sharon Bowers or Susanne Beck's Retribution, Restitution and Redemption series. These can be a bit challenging to find, but can usually be ordered through Amazon.com.

That's just a subset from my collection. Hope it's helpful.

[Eyes Without A Face]

Colette: the Claudine series. Awesome (and so was the French miniseries of it)! And Anais Nin also deserves mention!

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Wallpapers

[KittyKo]

I have a sugestion: Memoirs of a Geisha by Arthur Golden.

[lion + dove]

thanks all *smile* I read Colette's Gigi last autumn, while a quick read, i wasn't quite sure what to make of it. Also read Dragonriders of Pern, too.

but i'll definitely look into the Claudine series. (I can't believe I forgot to add her to my list).

and for strong female character/male writer I'm offering up Tess of the D'Ubervilles by Thomas Hardy. but I worn you you might have some issues with Hardy.

SPOILER (of the major variety) WARNING (re: Hardy, Chopin, Wharton)
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I'm not a big fan of the whole liberating a women then killing her prototype (see Awakening, Tess (further aggravated by Tess setting up her love with her "purer" sister- bleh!), and House of Mirth). in a way, I know it was a powerful statement about how society then treated liberated/independent/iconoclastic femmes, but it still pisses me off. damn it, can you just let them be happy? tess is partially excused by the fact that all of hardy's books (that i've read) are dark and tortuous on leads characters. but it still doesn't make me happy.

the documentary the Celluloid Closet has some excellent work on the same cliche in movies- especially with lesbian characters. if you want to check it out, then chuck stuff at the imaginary studio heads in your mind.

edited to add: does anyone have a suggestion of an earlier work where an great female character ends the book happy and alive? and preferably unmarried (aka "tamed" damn you Shakespeare for tempering Kate at the end of Taming of the Shrew)

[This message has been edited by lion + dove (edited December 15, 2001).]

[Wendy]

quote:

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does anyone have a suggestion of an earlier work where an great female character ends the book happy and alive? and preferably unmarried

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Zora Neale Hurston wrote mainly in the 1920s and 1930s; I'd try "Their Eyes Were Watching God" and a short story, "Sweat."

Harriet Jacobs' real-life slave narrative, "Incidents in the Life of a Slave Girl." "Reader, my story ends with freedom, not in the usual way, with marriage." (A little SO to Jane Eyre, there)

The narrator in Sarah Orne Jewett's "Country of Pointed Firs" never marries, does she?quote:

[RomanceJunky]

I am only just awakw enough to add three selections to the already pretty good list started here:

Fried Green Tomatoes At The Whistle Stop Cafe, by Fannie Flagg

Still one of my all-time favorite books...the movie, though good, just couldn't do it true justice.

Gone With The Wind, by Margeret Mitchell

A story about a silly and pampered young woman who through the dust and carnage of war on her doorstep, and the loss of all she knew and held dear, discovers an inner-fire in her Irish/American soul, and the strength to become the bitch that was needed to rebuild her life and support her family. A determined spirit in a time when women, like children, were better seen but not heard. And a STRONG woman? Un-natural..."As God is my witness!"

The Shield Of Three Lions, by Pamela Kaufman

Wonderful trip to the day's of King Richard the LionHeart's crusade...and the adventures of an amazing young woman who disguises herself as a boy to follow him to the holy land and seek his help...well done and absolutely halarious...(like my typing and spelling this morning )

Madame President, By T.Novan and Blayne Cooper

Of the uber Xena school, this is one of the most entertaining books of any kind I've read in years. Run, don't walk to The Open Book and snag this one...it's just newly re-published by R.A.P. books.

Enough...need coffee...must have coffee...

RJ

[tyche]

My favourite female chararcter in a book would have to be Dorothea in 'Middlemarch' by George Eliot. I also love Maggie in 'The Mill on the Floss'.
As for books .. there's such a long list. I'll edit this when I get home.

[Hemiola]

Thanks, JodiMnstr, for bringing up science fiction and fantasy. As long as we're in that field we shouldn't overlook two outstanding women writers: Andre Norton and Leigh Brackett (it's amazing how many people still don't know that these two writers were women ; Brackett also wrote the screenplay for "The Empire Strikes Back").

For children's books, mention should be made of Pamela L. Travers ("Mary Poppins"), Beatrix Potter ("Peter Rabbit" et al), and Marjorie Rawlings ("The Yearling"). For some reason (I guess it's old age ), I can't recall the name of the fine Canadian writer of the "Anne of Green Gables" books.

[lion + dove]

Lucy Maude Montgomery (author of the Anne books)

and for the record, the Harriet Jacobs book is already in my shopping cart at Amazon (where my book gift cert is from). thanks much, Wendy. that line you quoted was enough to make me add it, and everything else i read after i read that has just made me hope the package gets here inhumanly fast *ha!*

[Krystin]

1) Fried Green Tomatoes at the Whistle Stop Cafe -- Fannie Flagg

Great Book, no other explanation needed

2)The Voyage Out -- Virginia Woolf

My very favorite author, and this is my very favorite book. An interesting look at the role of women in early 20th century post-Victorian culture.

3,4,5) Emma; Mansfield Park; Persuasian -- Jane Austen

Great books, and while many say that Austen was only concerned with the lives and social habits of the wealthy that is untrue. These books explore issues of gender, and social inequality. Moreover, the female characters are strong women.
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Favorite book of all time...

A Wrinkle in Time -- Madeleine L'Engle

[This message has been edited by Krystin (edited December 16, 2001).]

[Dumbsaint]

Oh, goddess? Picking one favorite female character from fiction? I really don't think I'm up for the task, because Maharet from Queen of the Damned, Damia from The Rowan series, Quickening from the Shannara series, and Menolly from the Dragonriders are all just too loveable and enticing to pick between them. And I'm sure I'm forgetting some, too, this early in the morning.

JodiMnstr, you're a girl after my own heart. I love love love Anne McCaffrey. I reread bits and pieces from the Dragonrider's series every time I'm laid up in bed sick. It's like comfort food, only less filling and in print. I also adore her Talents series, starting with The Rowan. Woo! Strong chicks, psychic powers, precocious children, cats- what's not to love?

A few people have mentioned Fannie Flagg and Fried Green Tomatoes, but my favorite from her is actually Daisy Fay and the Miracle Man, which is hands down the funniest southern novel I have ever read. And there are some pretty damned funny ones out there, lemme tell ya.

I have to go on record as an Anne Rice whore, too. I haven't liked her more recent stuff as much as the old, but the Vampire Chronicles and the Mayfair Witches series (as well as her take on a certain fairy tale) remain to this day some of the lushest prose and most delightfully twisted storylines around.

I have to recommend Jeanette Winterson to anyone who hasn't read her. "Oranges Are Not the Only Fruit," and "Written on the Body" are both incredible, but for completely different reasons. "The Passion" is supposed to be amazing, too, but I'm hoarding that one, having squirreled it away for future reading on some unseen rainy day. I'm weird like that with books, go figure.

Finally, last year at the prompting of a writer buddy of mine I picked up Tipping the Velvet by Sarah Waters. It absolutely blew my mind. If you haven't read it, run, do not walk, to your nearest bookseller. It's profoundly fabulous. Really.

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This mummy hand has ceased to BE! It is an EX-mummy hand!

['lucy' moore]

Here's a couple of suggestions...
Havenstar by Glenda Noramly.(don't know about other territories,but published in the uk by virgin publishing in 1999).
or,How about any of the Sword and Sorceress books published by Daw and edited by the late Marion Zimmer Bradley (in the uk you could probably find them at Forbidden Planet or other import stores).

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fiat justitia,ruat caelum.

[tommo]

Is there something wrong with me that I don't really like Jeanette Winterson? I studied her at university and I wasn't overly impressed then. I can't help feeling like I'm betraying my lesbian sisters...heh heh.

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"You evil bitch troll from hell!" ~ Patsy Stone

[Puff]

I love reading Patrica Cornwell and Laurie King. Strong female writers, with strong female characters.

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Bloody hell, sodding, limey, shagging, knickers, bollocks...oh God...I'm English

[Salicin]

i realy like the female characters in Christopher Fowler's books (gay British horror writer!) Rune & Roofworld.. but it's been a very long time (between 5 & 10 years!) since i've read them so i can't remember their names now..

i recently finished American Gods by Neil Gaiman & loved the character Samantha Black Crow in that (although she's not in *that* much of the book) who's also a lesbian..

Laurie & Jaqe & from Godmother Night by Rachel Pollack

Boda & Sibyl from Pollen by Jeff Noon

Olympia from Geek Love by Katherine Dunn

there's probably more, but that'll do for now!

>Eksi<

[Dumbsaint]

quote:

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Originally posted by tommo:
Is there something wrong with me that I don't really like Jeanette Winterson? I studied her at university and I wasn't overly impressed then. I can't help feeling like I'm betraying my lesbian sisters...heh heh.

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Yes, Ruth. I'm sorry, but you'll have to turn in your membership card to the lesbian nation at once, and hand over any and all Indigo Girls CDs, flannel shirts, turkey basters, U-Hauls, jeeps, toasters, Terra Firma harnesses, or Lilith Fair ticket stubs. We trust your stay here in Lesbonia has been a happy one and wish you well on your return to the status quo. Thank you and have a pleasant tomorrow.

Well... unless of course you'd be willing to work out some kind of deal. You know, a lil sum'n sum'n to tide this officer of the Lesbian Police over until you can show proof of having read and enjoyed a JW (fabulous initials, by the way) book. I'm sure we could work something out...

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This mummy hand has ceased to BE! It is an EX-mummy hand!quote:

[Italiangirl]

Ooooohhh, great thread!

Some amazing books with amazing women:

Divine Secrets of the YaYa Sisterhood, by Rebecca Wells...the YaYas are funny and strong and serious and big hearted and like family.

The Bean Trees by Barbara Kingsolver

Bastard Out of Carolina by Dorothy Allison

The Color Purple by Alice Walker

Mama Day by Gloria Naylor

Sassafrass, Cypress & Indigo by Ntozake Shange.

There are also some great lesbian non-fics that I'm in love with. The best of all is The Work of A Common Woman by Judy Grahn. It is a book of feminist lesbian poetry, it blows me away every time I read it. I would like to post a sample from it here, but I'm wondering about the off-topicness? Any objections?

Also, Cunt by Inga Muscio and of course The Vagina Monologues.

The Dream of A Common Language, by Adrienne Rich, Goddess of lesbian identity, life-knowledge and dreams, and...

Finally, Zami, A New Spelling of My Name
by Audre Lorde, goddess of lesbian strength.

[Cicca]

Books! Yay!
Favourite female characters? Meg Murry from A Wrinkle in Time... Jilly Coppercorn and the Crow Girls (all from Charles de Lint's stories). Patricia Kennealy's Aeron. Anne McCaffrey's Menolly and Lessa. MZB's Margali.

Recommendations?
Gael Baudino's Strands series. Fantasy/historical fiction. Very strong and interesting female characters. She's also an "out" lesbian and has strong lesbian characters. Watch out for her other books. I've found her Water series to be nearly unreadable. If you're into different forms of writing and storytelling, you might find it interesting, but it drove me nuts.
---> oops, I've just been rereading these and I'm trying to figure out how I remembered strong lesbian characters... Um. Maybe in the last one. And I'd say to stick with the first one, Strands of Starlight. The sequels are quite bleak.

Patricia Kennealy's Keltiad.
Starting with The Copper Crown. Fantastic characters and wonderful stories. Kelts iiiiin spaaaaaaaace! heehee

A Natural History of the Sense. Diane Ackerman. This is my favourite book.

Marion Zimmer Bradley. The Mists of Avalon.
The Shattered Chain, Thendara House, and City of Sorcery. These three are a sort of trilogy in the Darkover series. They involve the "free amazons". Good stuff.

Rita Mae Brown. Rubyfruit Jungle. Venus Envy (even though she gets a bit goofy at the end). The murder mysteries with Sneaky Pie Brown are lots of fun.

A.S. Byatt. Possession.

Charles de Lint. Yes, he's a man. He writes wonderful magical stories with great women characters. You can pick a novel or a series of short stories, depending on your taste.

I also really enjoy the fairy tale series put out by Ellen Datlow and Terri Windling. Well, I did before they got so expensive!

Oh, one more. Glass Houses. Kieran Llachlan Leavitt. Great story. I think it's only available online through RAPbooks.

There!
Let's see if this lets me post so I can delurk!

[This message has been edited by Cicca (edited December 30, 2001).]

[fell]

I am in thunderous agreement with JodMnstr and Dumbsaint, and second the recommendations made by both.
I'm glad to see mention of Gael Baudino's 'Strands of Starlight' series. Highly recommended.

Here's a list of some less well known/less prolific authors. A lot of these are by and/or about lesbians.

Emma Bull- War for the Oaks (If you like Mercedes Lackey's collaborations in the Serrated Edge series, this is even better, imho.)
Nicola Griffith- Slow River
Anne Harris- The Nature of Smoke
Sheri S. Tepper- A Plague of Angels
Margaret Atwood- The Handmaid's Tale
Joan Slonczewski- A Door into Ocean
Pamela Sargent- The Shore of Women

I'm a long-time reader of Fantasy and SF by women and am always hungry for more. Thanks to all those who have made recommendations.

[lion + dove]

Welcome Cicca *smile* and thanks for bringing about Madeleine L'Engle- especially Meg.

been meaning to read Possession. another current English femme I did read was Anita Brookner's Hotel Du Lac (another Booker Prize winner). a little ruminative for some tastes but amazing companion piece to Mann's Death in Venice told from a woman's point of view.

speaking of Booker Prize winners, I love Margaret Atwood! how could I forget her. her Handmaid's Tale is amazing piece of feminist lit and I highly recommend The Blind Assasin. sci fi embedded within a tale of two sisters. i'm at amazon right now checking out the rest of your list, fell.

okay, I can't hold a candle to y'all's sci-fi and fantasy knowledge, but in a few recommendations meant for young girls (9-12ish) but great read for us "oldies" too:

Quest for a Maid by Frances Hendry. I read this in 6th grade, and it was the first book I ever felt truly good about crying over. Set in Late Middle Ages Scotland, features Meg, one of the best strong characters for young girls. Brave, complex, and conflicted.

Some warnings though it does feature witchcraft in an ambivalent light (example (and still my favorite opening line ever): "When I was nine years old, I hid under a table and heard my sister kill a king."). Her sister is a powerful witch to whom the most powerful men (and women) feel beholden too- but she does kill a king (and more). However, the church and aristocracy are also heavily criticized for their treatment/persecution of witches....

I read it every year.

And also The Forest Wife by Teresa Tomlinson. I discovered this while working in a bookstore and quickly put it on my recommended list. I felt wonderfully subversive (in a constructive way) every time I sent a parent home with the feminist retelling of the Maid Marian story for their little girls (Maid Marian runs away from a forced, horrible marriage to become a midwife).

couple of modern (oh the horror! sorry i like to make fun i've my own pretention on a regular basis, and what with so much of it to make fun of) female authors i like:

Louise Erdrich
Bharati Mukherjee
Banana Yoshimoto (start with Kitchen, with the added plus of glbt themes)
Donna Tartt (A Secret History)

and wow! thanks for the Anne-Marie MacDonald req.

[This message has been edited by lion + dove (edited December 16, 2001).]

[Willowlicious]

quote:

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Originally posted by Dumbsaint:

Finally, last year at the prompting of a writer buddy of mine I picked up Tipping the Velvet by Sarah Waters. It absolutely blew my mind. If you haven't read it, run, do not walk, to your nearest bookseller. It's profoundly fabulous. Really.

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Oh, yes, yes, yes! That is a FANTASTIC book! It is a gorgeously detailed tour through 1888 London that just happens to feature a lesbian as its (fascinating) central character. This is flat out literature, not lesbian literature.

God, I'm such a nerd. You say "1888 London" and "lesbian" in the same sentence and I get all worked up. I'm a unabashed history buff. Sigh.

quote:

[greatluna]

has noone mentioned "Fall On Your Knees" by Ann-Marie Macdonald yet? if you're into Austen & Wharton & Cather this will blow your mind. it blew mine, and i keep returning to this novel two years after reading it for the first time. a handful of absolutely astounding female characters, and if they don't turn this into a movie soon, i don't know what else will...

oh, the plot is basically the story of a Canadian family and the town they live in, from the late 19th century up to the'60s. and there's a couple of *surprises* along the way, but i'll just keep my mouth shut about that

[Wolfie]

Kinda ripped through this thread (running outa time), so might have missed someone else posting these, but:

Franny and Zooey by JD Salinger - my favourite all-time characters. Have obsessed over both since reading the book for the first time, when I was 21. Salinger writes characters that you either completely identify with (in a big way, in my case), or you just wanna slap, I guess, but I love 'em! Any of his books are genius, but I thing F&Z is the best.

If you like that one, then also try Generation X by Douglas Coupland. I also identified with the characters (two male, one female), and really liked them, and his sense of humour is right up my twisted little alley! There is this amazing bit, where Dag tells this story of being in a supermarket when the end of the world happens - that kiss is one of the most moving things I have ever read. It just got under my skin, and won't let go - in a totally good way. I can't stop reading it out to people, then beaming at them, all shiney-eyed, and crooning "isn't that amazing?" Never considered I was a label-kind of person, until I read that book, then said "Oh. That's me. I do belong, in a not-very-belongy-kind-of-way. Cool."

[Dream]

quote:

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Originally posted by KittyKo:
I have a sugestion: Memoirs of a Geisha by Arthur Golden.

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Oh yeah, definitely. It might be not a literature classic as let's say, Virginia Woolf books, but it's a good read. I also second the person who recommended Patricia Cornwell books (mostly her earlier work).
And if you're into crime novels, try anything by Kathy Reichs...

My personal favorite though is Anchee Min. Again it's not something you'll study at school or Uni, but she writes amazingly (IMO, anyway), and both her books "Red Azalea" and "Katherine" have women who fall in love with each other.

And if I'll spend any more time on this board instead of doing my job, I might actually get fired...

quote:

[Salicin]

female childrens authors >

Susan Cooper (she did The Dark Is Rising series of 5 books > Over Sea Under Stone, The Dark Is Rising, Greenwitch, The Grey King & Silver On The Tree, which are filled with Arthurian & Celtic legends - i read them as a child, & again as an adult & i still adore them)

Tove Jansson - Author of the Moomins

other women authors >

Ursula Le Guin

Octavia E Butler (acclaimed black female science fiction author - who my mother introduced me to as a child)

Angela Carter

& Leonora Carrington (& i adore her character Virginia Fur - as immortalised in the Dog Faced Hermans song which features lyrics appropriatted from an Angela Carter piece, from the short story As
They Rode Along The Edge from The Seventh Horse & Other Tales

>sin<

[This message has been edited by Salicin (edited December 16, 2001).]

[mollyig]

Books feed your head!

Laurie R King's Kate Martinelli series. Anything by Barbara Kingsolver, Margaret Atwood, Carson McCullers, Flannery O'Connor, J California Cooper.

I'm sure there's more, but can't think yet, haven't had my morning coffee.

Great thread though! Great suggestions for books to add to my wish list!

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"To let this love survive would be the greatest gift that we could give"
Emily Saliers (Indigo Girls)

[Psyche]

My favourite female writer is probably Dorothy L. Sayers,
i love all her books and Harriet Vane is wonderful (though
overshadowed by Lord Peter...) highly recommended.

Some modern authors:

SF/F:

Patricia McKillip. Probably best known for the Riddlemaster series.
(Raederle is my ersatz nick/name if the usual are not available)
But everything from her is at least very good and often excellent.
Great sense of language.

Ursula K. LeGuin (the Earthsea trilogy (and Tehanu is good, but doesn't
belong to the series...))

Crime:

Carol O'Connor: the Mallory-series. intriguing heroine, though severly
disturbed individual...

Karen Kijewski: Kat Colorado

[Shaniezak]

I stubbornly maintain my vote for Terry Moore's Strangers in Paradise comic book series. Hey, they're available in trade paperback volumes, right? Does that count?

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"And where does magick come from? I think magick's in the learning . . ." -- Dar Williams

"And if there is a way to find you, I will find you . . . but threads that are golden don't break easily . . ." -- Tori Amos