Butch, Queen...stereotypes in our lives and in the media

[dekalog]

Personally as I have matured I have been able to put things into perspective more and more - and as has been said to say if you don't care for who I am then we go our separate ways and you will never know what you missed in having to get to know me.



It's not as easy when you are younger. Hell, I must admit even when you are older it isn't that easy. It would be certainly much easier if we all just accepted who each of us is and celebrated each other for our differences, so what stops us? Stereotypes can help in others not seeing us for who we are, but instead lets them not have to look further than what they think we are. In my mind stereotypes are often weapons to justify the ism's that abound in our society.



There is a great book by Anne Bishop called Becoming an Ally: Breaking the Cycle of Oppression that talks in brief about name calling , breaking silences, and healing. In it she talks alot about if we all sat at each other's table and got to know each other we could start the process of individual healing that could lead us to a more socially just society. If not that at least we could possibly start seeing each other as individuals and not as the stereotypes associated with our particular group.

[friskylez]

My apologies Xita, i should have been more specific with what i said about Brandon Teena and MS..Im in no way shape or form saying anyone here said anything like they deserved it....



I have had people say to me that if they didnt "act" or "look" gay they wouldnt have been attacked...

Some were from the gay community, some from the str8 community....



Anyway, should have left that out....Sorry for the misrepresentation..I do hope that the discussion here educates, enlightens and leads to understanding and tolerance..Peace..

[Isychos]

Quote:

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I used to dress butch before I got my teaching job. I will admit to having grown my hair specifically to avoid problems at work... No amount of social pressure is going to make me wear a dress or start wearing make up. If I ever did any of those things it would be because I wanted to.

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I thiink what you said here Xita brings up and excellent thought on STs. We all know that STs exist in our society and even if the way we live fits into one of these we shouldn't have to change our personalities or lifestyles to avoid them. But how far should we go in our work to avoid them? It sounds as if you didn't care if you had long hair or short hair, but just having short hair was your preference. However, by growing your hair out you felt this would cause less problems.



In my line of work I have to do alot of acting. I own a rental store that concentrates on wedding rentals but alone it is not enough to support my business. So I also rent some tools and equipment. If I just be myself I am sort of feminine, which causes no problems in my main source of business, but not in the other. Even though I own my business, if I was to act the way I do naturally I would lose sales on some of my equipment. For some reason it seems if I dont cuss and scratch myself inappropriately it means I dont know anything about tools for contractors (IE nail guns, asphalt rollers, and trenchers.) So what do I do? When a person comes in looking to rent something of that sorts, I purposly lower my voice, act meaner, say h*ll and d*mn alot, and grunt like a neanderthal. After that, whatever I say becomes gospel. If I dont do this I will lose business because I rent things I supposedly know nothing about and will not make enough income to support the type of business I do enjoy doing which is weddings.



So I ask, how far should we go in our professional lives to avoid, or even embrace, a stereotype if the outcome will make the lives of ourselves or the ones we care about better?

The sky is blue and all the leaves are green. The sun's as warm as a baked potato. I think I know precisely what I mean, When I say it's a Shpadoinkle day.

[Gatito Grande]

Wow, Isychos, what a mind-blowing, counter-intuitive example of "donning an obligatory mask." As I debate whether I can "get away with" cutting my hair as I job-hunt, I'll remember it works both (all?) ways.



GG . . . who always caught hell for "non-ladylike" behavior, from spitting (hey, I have post-nasal drip---it beats *choking*), to stretching, to the way I cross my legs, to my frickin' *walk*. Screw Society's Standards (whether masculine or feminine)! Out

[friskylez]

Isychos, That is a really good question..i wouldnt take a job where i had to wear a dress for work, id feel to out of place and uncomfortable...



Im out at work, its a choice i made and i can be myself, for that im lucky..There are some who arent so lucky, they have to do what they have to do to get by..I totally understand that.



Im not in favor of outing people or saying someone is wrong because they choose to remain "in the closet" at work or whatever..



I think its up to the individual, whatever they feel is the best thing for them..

[sprhrgrl]

Isychos, it's cool that your jobs are so stereotypically polar. . . Well, cool in my brain because I go for that kind of thing anyway (laugh).



GG, about the hair. . . I say cut it because why would you want to work in an environment where you couldn't be who you want to be? But then you mightn't have that luxury. . . What do you do again?



My friend Alex had a really tricky time finding a job because she's tiny and butch and they would look at her and go "Sandra?" and then push her out the door to find some hot femme girls to use to sell their products. She ended up finding a job in a less conservative area. There's a thread about this in the trans section of the strap-on.org board. . . (disclaimer) I'm not saying that butch=trans, but it's still relevant because we're talking gender presentation in the workplace . . .



Yeah yeah, I don't know.

sprhrgrl.com

she's my everything

Sweetie, I'm a fag. I been there. - Tara

The truth shall set you free, but first it will piss you off. - Gloria Steinem

[jixer]

Hello Kittens-



I'm not sure what I can add here. I'm a male who likes girls (well, one woman who was silly enough to marry me) and considers himself human. That's about it. I've got other labels attached like American, straight, night shift, fisherman, hunter, Cubs fan, liberal, conservative, and Kitten. Some I chose (this IS the Cubs year, they're going to turn it around) and some I picked up because I fit somebody else's pigeonhole. I resent some of them and it's embarrassing when I find myself throwing out labels too. I try not to when I realize I'm doing it.



There is one label I don't mind using, mostly with people I like- "couple". Everyone I know and enjoy being with fits that label. Maybe it's where I'm at now or maybe it's the "Old Married Matchmaker" label one of my soon to be not single anymore co- workers used on several of us who have been predicting her "laid back" commitment ceremony was going to be anything but and are turning out to be right. I could have told you that. She's a dry fly, split bamboo rod, stream and river hatch matcher who dabbles in lakes. Any of us lure using, graphite rod, lake and ocean beach casters could have told you all about that type.





Jixer

[Lt Sticks]

ah, the stereotypes, how ive not missed them so...



Lol my friends at university call me a butchette, because they, and I think i cant be in either femme or butch groups. Which is great, because they cant say im stereotypical



The butchy parts are i guess my tomboyish ways, and my appearance (short hair, hates girly stuff) but im very idealistic, wanting to be swept off my feet by the ideal girl, and my straight friends think thats only a femme thing, of course it isnt



Personally im not too worried about stereotyping, unless its negative and nasty. Then im a pissed off Sticks.



~Emma

A fire in my heart, reborn from the ashes...just call me Phoenix


I'm Under Your Spell, nothing I can do, you just took my soul with you...

JediBites.Com Forums

[Tempest Duer]

GG, I love your last sign-off. It really spoke to me, buddy. STs bug me too, to a certain degree, but I live with them, and abuse them as much as I can. I try not to let things bother me because stereotyping is a human. People want to categorize everything in the hopes that it will make things easier to understand. Of course, that's not true, but it doesn't stop us from doing that, now does it?



STs are ugly, make no mistake. I'm not trying to stand up for the narrowminded fools who decide to say that all _______ people are _______, but we all do it, whether we think about it or not.



I'm a walking stereotype, from the way I walk to the way I talk and the way I treat people who give me trouble. And to a point, I'm kind of proud of it. Fitting a stereotype in a way makes it easier to be just who I am, because really people kind of expect my behavior from me after a while.



It also makes it hard for me to be closeted, and forces me to be upfront with people about who I am, but such things really aren't a good reason to purport STs.



I suppose I'm trying to make a point here, but really I just wanted to share my views.

Willow: Hey Buff. One more thing. Buffy: Yeah? Willow: I’m gay. Buffy: Okay, Will. Xander owes me ten bucks.

~Remember to Breathe by Yellow Crayon

[eveningstar845]

I'm a lesbian. I wear long hear, dresses and make-up. I probably fit into the lipstick lesbian category. But I hate that word- it makes me feel like I'm not a lesbian.

When I was young and I didn't know many lesbians. I did try to look and act more butch just to prove that I wasn't just curious or experimenting. Becuase that was the impression I got from the media about lesbians, stereotype lesbians. ( Except the lesbian bar in most TV shows which I think it's a gay bar in stright men's fantasy.) I think that might be the same reason for the teens butching up. Now I'm more comfortable about myself and realize about the diversity of gay people, I 'm just being myself.

For me, I think people should wear and act the way they want, stereotype or not. And people will never stop lebel you no matter how you act. Straight people get lebeled too.

And pls forgive me for saying this- I don't date butch. And it's not discrimination-I'm just not attracted. Call me shallow but looks matter to me. Not that butch don't look good, but I tend to go for the femme or maybe I haven't met the right one.

The only abnormality is the incapacity to love - Anais Nin

[Lt Sticks]

omg i LOATHE that word, lipstick lesbian, makes me cringe every time



<>



Hey, u have a right to find the right one for u, and if that one aint butch, hey thats not being mean or discriminating IMO Go u!

A fire in my heart, reborn from the ashes...just call me Phoenix


I'm Under Your Spell, nothing I can do, you just took my soul with you...

JediBites.Com Forums