by Gatito Grande » Sun Nov 28, 2004 11:50 pm
Quote:
As a Canadian Anglican, I certainly don't feel that my church has done all it can and should for equality.
) of near-equality for LGBT people (take a bow! 
)
Out by russ » Mon Nov 29, 2004 7:26 am
Quote:
Who can blame them for leaving the church?
LEANNE LARMONDIN
Elsewhere on these pages is a letter from a now-former Anglican. The man, like many gays and lesbians before him and certainly some to follow, has left his church after too many years of discord and rejection.
It is unknown how many Anglicans like this man are no longer among our numbers. Some say it has been a slow, steady trickle away from the denomination.
It is true that the media (including Anglican Journal) have given a great deal of attention to parishes and clergy who leave the church because of a perceived creeping liberalization of their denomination and its policies on sexuality. However, many of the church's flock have simply left quietly by the side door.
Tired of being spoken about rather than spoken to, weary of being the scapegoat for the church's growing divide between liberals and conservatives, many have moved on. They find more accepting congregations like the Metropolitan Community Church or some United churches; others simply leave the church altogether.
And who can blame them?
At last June's meeting of General Synod, I met an interested observer occasionally in the halls during the meeting. She worked at the university which was hosting the gathering and each time we met, she asked how the meeting was going, specifically how the synod was dealing with the question of same-sex blessings. Once married to an Anglican, she had left the church behind in her new life with her female partner. Still, though, she said she followed the developments in the Anglican Church of Canada. She and her partner, she said, would happily return to the church if they felt the church would have them. When the synod eventually voted to defer a decision on the blessings, I met her again by chance in the halls. She smiled ruefully and said, shaking her head, "By not making a decision, they made a decision." She and her partner, clearly, will wait to return to the fold.
The church -- here in Canada, the United States and abroad -- has long wrestled with the role of gays and lesbians in church life. As I write these words, I know that some readers have already stopped reading. Enough, they say. For such a small minority of church members, gay and lesbian Anglicans get an inordinate amount of attention, much of it undeserved.
Many gays and lesbians, I'm sure, would agree.
To be defined and dismissed on the basis of the gender of one's partner, regardless of one's actions, good or bad, is perverse.
Let's get on with what is important, many say.
Nevertheless, some Anglicans still appear to be single-mindedly spinning around, drawing lines in the sand in vain attempts to separate themselves from others.
"That fellow over there thinks Muslims can enter the kingdom of God without accepting Christ; that bishop laid hands on a gay priest or a bishop; that parish invited a heretical author to speak at its church. That priest -- sure he's celibate now -- but he is still living with his male partner and hasn't repented his past."
Then there is the bishop who will not participate in an episcopal consecration because he cannot bear to stand at the same altar as a fellow bishop who permits same-sex blessings in his diocese. Another bars a fellow prelate from his diocese because of the other's position on sexuality.
As some are increasingly wont to define for themselves -- and for others -- who is and who is not a true believer, they risk alienating the moderate middle with their game of "if you're not for us, you're against us."
Where is Christ in all of this?
Later this month all the speculation about the Lambeth Commission on sexuality will be behind us.
Will the report recommend sanctions against the church in the United States and Canada ? Will it envision a new configuration of Anglican provinces, a federation? Will it affirm provinces' right to autonomy? We will soon know.
Closer to home, less than two years from now, the Primate's Theological Commission will report back to the national church its findings on "whether the blessing of committed, same-sex unions is a matter of doctrine." Many across the spectrum of Anglicanism have already made up their minds on this matter. Some will forge ahead with their plans to exercise a local, diocesan option to begin blessing same-gender relationships.
Others, confident that the blessings are a doctrinal matter, and the church having nonetheless already given tacit approval by affirming the "sanctity" of same-sex relationships, will eschew existing Anglican structures for parallel networks of like-minded primates, bishops and groups -- more a congregational model than true Anglicanism.
When the Theological Commission reaches its conclusions, will the question be moot? And who will be around to hear the response, when it comes?
Anglican Journal, October 2004
Russ
When we love and give it everything we've got, no matter what the consequences, we are doing what we were put here to do -- Geneen Roth
by Gatito Grande » Mon Nov 29, 2004 12:21 pm
Out by russ » Tue Nov 30, 2004 7:16 am
Quote:
our religious wackos run the government here, and yours don't!
Russ
When we love and give it everything we've got, no matter what the consequences, we are doing what we were put here to do -- Geneen Roth
by Gatito Grande » Wed Dec 01, 2004 1:50 am
) for your commitment and example! 
Out
by Warduke » Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:07 pm
Quote:
Church Says CBS, NBC Reject Ad Spot
CLEVELAND - A liberal-leaning church said CBS and NBC rejected a national spot because it alludes to condemnation of gay relationships by some churches.
The 30-second spot launched Wednesday highlights the Cleveland-based United Church of Christ's welcoming stance toward gays and anyone else who might feel shunned elsewhere.
The networks said the spot was too controversial to broadcast because it implied exclusion of gay and lesbian couples by other groups, according to the UCC.
A CBS spokesman said gay relationships were a matter of public debate and "we have a long policy of not accepting advocacy advertising." Messages seeking comment were left Wednesday at NBC's New York and West Coast offices.
The ad was accepted by ABC Family, AMC, BET, Discovery and TBS, among others, the church said.
The ad, part of a 3 1/2-week, $1.7 million campaign, shows a muscular bouncer working a rope line outside a nameless church and deciding who is eligible to enter and worship.
"No, step aside, please," he says to two men holding hands.
Across the screen comes the message, "Jesus didn't turn people away. Neither do we." The final scene shows two women embracing.
"We're doing it because we made a discovery: There are lots of people out there who don't know we exist," said Ron Buford, who is coordinating the program for the 1.3 million-member denomination, down from 1.7 million in 1989.
The UCC has 6,000 congregations.
by Gatito Grande » Thu Dec 02, 2004 12:27 am
Quote:
Church trial of lesbian minister opens
By Jim Remsen
A high-profile United Methodist Church trial opened today with the prosecution insisting that the church cannot allow non-celibate lesbians to serve as ordained ministers.
Addressing a jury of pastors, the Rev. Thomas Hall said that church rules required them to defrock the Rev. Beth Stroud, an associate pastor at First United Methodist Church of Germantown.
"This may well be one of the most painful days of my life," Hall, the lead prosecutor, declared in the makeshift courtroom at a church retreat center near Pottstown. "But we have a charge to hold one another accountable for our actions."
The defense counsel, the Rev. J. Dennis Williams, countered that the church's rules are "more nuanced" than Hall contends, and he asked the jurors to "discern if Beth Stroud's ministry is being blessed by God."
Stroud, 34, also took the stand to tell the court - and a visitor gallery packed with her supporters, "[I'm] doing the best I know how to be obedient to God's calling."
Stroud's defense may have already been dealt a mortal blow, however. The judge issued a ruling just before the trial began that disallowed the defense team's key argument: that banning "self-avowed, practicing homosexuals" from the clergy violates the spirit of the denomination's constitution, which says "the Word of God is preached by persons divinely called" and lists no bars to the ministry.
That ruling limited the focus to the denomination's Book of Discipline, which declares homosexuality "incompatible with Christian teachings" and prohibits the ordaining and appointment of practicing gays and lesbians. The denomination's convention and its highest court took action recently to reinforce that prohibition.
With conflicts over gay rights deeply dividing the 8.5 million-member denomination, and much of American religion, the case has been closely watched around the country. An estimated two-thirds of Methodists support the ban on gay clergy, though there is a vocal dissident camp.
If the jury of nine male and four female pastors convicts Stroud, she could be ordered to surrender her ministry credentials. The defense will make its case when the trial resumes this morning.
Stroud precipitated the trial when she gave a sermon on Easter 2003 in which she told congregants at her gay-friendly church that she was living in a "covenant relationship" with another woman.
The case has made her a cause celebre, and scores of her supporters turned out for today's proceedings at Camp Innabah, a wooded complex in rural Pughtown. Many sported the rainbow-colored stoles of the gay-rights movement and wore name tags declaring "Beth is my pastor."
The opening witness was Boston Bishop Peter Weaver, who was until recently presiding bishop of this area, and who initiated the process that led to the trial - which is a last resort under church procedures. Weaver said Stroud declined the options of celibacy, surrendering her ministry credentials, or departing for another denomination.
Instead, he said, Stroud wanted "a journey of truth-telling. I affirmed that as important for all of us. She set the tone of saying the church is not the enemy but we are family... and we can model that we are one in Christ."
Stroud was next on the stand. In sometimes tearful testimony, she said she decided to challenge the church ban because "Christians take risks and Christians stand up for what they believe is right."
Her hope, she said, was that the trial "will be a learning moment for the church, a time of deep listening where we are so open to each other that we might even change our minds."
Outside the courtroom - an erstwhile gymnasium on the leafy grounds of the camp - members of Stroud's church and gay-rights Methodist organizations stood vigil with banners and songs. They were joined by the national activist group Soulforce, who were protesting the trial as "an act of spiritual violence" against gays.
On the other side of the argument were the Rev. Karen Booth, director of Transforming Congregations, and Bill Taylor of Exodus. These two controversial Christian groups assist gays who want to become heterosexual.
"We believe homosexual behavior is a sinful behavior," Booth said, as she stood in the morning drizzle. "And we support the church position, as do most Methodists."
In church trials, the judge, jury and lead counsel are all ordained clergy. The judge is Bishop Joseph H. Yeakel of Maryland, an expert in church law who has presided over 13 other ecclesiastical trials.
Seated behind Stroud throughout the daylong proceeding were her partner, Chris Paige, and her parents and two sisters.
In March, the Rev. Karen Dammann faced a similar trial in Washington state, where gay-rights sentiment is widespread. Dammann was acquitted after jurors said the Book of Discipline, while referring to the "sacred worth" of gays, did not specifically list homosexuality as a "chargeable offense" for ministers. An uproar ensued among church conservatives, prompting the judicial council, the church's highest court, to declare homosexuality a chargeable offense.
For the Stroud trial - the first test of the tightened rules - Yeakel obtained assurances from the clergy jurors that they could strictly enforce the Book of Discipline.
The defense was prepared to call six expert witnesses who would have argued, among other things, that the Methodist constitution prohibits discrimination based on sexual orientation, and that a celibacy requirement is inconsistent with Methodist theology.
Yeakel ruled that the witnesses' constitutional challenges were outside the bounds of a jury trial, but the defense managed to have a summary of the arguments entered into the court record so they could be raised on appeal.
Stroud said she has not decided whether to appeal if the jury rules against her.
The jury of 13 United Methodist pastors was drawn from across the 16-county Eastern Pennsylvania Annual Conference. At least nine votes are needed to convict.
If Stroud is convicted, she could be expelled from the denomination, lose her ministry credentials, or receive a lesser sentence such as a temporary suspension that would be subject to review.
If she loses her credentials, Stroud's 800-member church has promised she can continue her ministry work under a lay status, but without presiding at baptisms or Communion. Stroud has agreed to the offer.
The proceedings began with a prayer by the area Methodist bishop, Marcus Matthews, "seeking God's blessings and directions" during the trial. Matthews had declared today as a day of prayer for the 138,000 Methodists in the Eastern Pennsylvania Annual Conference's 500 churches.
Outby russ » Thu Dec 02, 2004 7:15 am
Russ
When we love and give it everything we've got, no matter what the consequences, we are doing what we were put here to do -- Geneen Roth
by WebWarlock » Thu Dec 02, 2004 1:59 pm
Quote:
Methodist Jury Convicts Lesbian Minister
By RICHARD N. OSTLING
AP Religion Writer
Published December 2, 2004, 1:33 PM CST
PUGHTOWN, Pa. -- A jury made up of United Methodist Church clergy convicted a lesbian minister Thursday of violating church law by openly living with her partner in a committed relationship.
The Rev. Irene Elizabeth Stroud could be defrocked as a result of the ruling, which came on the second day of her church trial. The same 13-member jury was set to meet Thursday afternoon to decide her penalty.
Methodist law bars "self-avowed, practicing homosexuals" from ministry. Nine votes were necessary for a conviction and the jury voted 12-1 to find Stroud guilty.
The last time the 8.3 million-member denomination convicted an openly gay cleric was in 1987, when a New Hampshire church court defrocked the Rev. Rose Mary Denman.
Last March, a Methodist court in Washington state acquitted the Rev. Karen Dammann, who lives with a same-sex partner, citing an ambiguity in church law that the Methodist supreme court has since eliminated.
Before the jury returned, Stroud, 34, told reporters that whatever the verdict, "this case has shown how divided we are" over the role of gays in the church. She had expected to be convicted.
Stroud, associate pastor at Philadelphia's First United Methodist Church of Germantown, set the case in motion last year when she announced to her bishop and congregation that she was living in a committed relationship with her partner, Chris Paige.
At her trial, Stroud's defense was dealt a blow when the presiding judge Joseph Yeakel, the retired bishop of Washington, D.C., excluded expert testimony from six defense witnesses who believe the church's gay clergy ban violates its own legal principles.
The senior pastor of Stroud's church, the Rev. Alfred Day III, attempted to raise a similar issue when he took the stand, saying "I believe that even the testimony of Scripture is far from clear on this subject."
"We have more muddle than clarity," he said. But the prosecuting attorney, the Rev. Thomas Hall of Exton, Pa., asked Yeakel to strike Day's statement and the judge instructed the jury that "constitutional issues are not before this court."
Stroud's defense counsel, the Rev. J. Dennis Williams, said in closing arguments that "the heart of the issue is whether all United Methodists, regardless of status, are to be afforded equal rights and equal opportunities."
"I only wish you could hear the full testimony we wished to present," Williams said.
But Hall told jurors they had a duty to "hold a good pastor accountable to the standard with which we all live" under the Methodist Book of Discipline.
The basic facts in the case were never in dispute, since Stroud had declared she was gay.
The only two defense witnesses to be called were Day and the senior pastor who supervised her in Westchester, Pa. Both lavishly praised her performance in preaching, teaching and pastoral work. Hall agreed with that assessment.
Stroud's supportive Philadelphia congregation has already agreed that she can continue doing her work as a lay employee without clergy status. However, she will be unable to celebrate baptism or Communion.
* __
On the Net:
Stroud's page: www.bethstroud.info
Eastern Pennsylvania Conference: www.epaumc.org
Web Warlock, web.warlock@comcast.net, The Other Side.
Liber Mysterium: The D20 Netbook of Witches & The Dragon and the Phoenix: New Adventures of Willow and Tara
"But nothing worth having comes without some kind of fight, Got to kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight"
- "Lovers In A Dangerous Time", Bruce Cockburn.
by Gatito Grande » Thu Dec 02, 2004 5:53 pm
) some documentary-makers decided, well over a year ago, to make a documentary on Beth's church (w/ her coming out featured prominently 
). It's scheduled to premiere on PBS on December 29 (check local listings). by Warduke » Mon Dec 27, 2004 3:34 pm
Quote:
Lesbian Minister to Challenge Defrocking
By RICHARD N. OSTLING, AP Religion Writer
A Methodist minister who was defrocked for declaring that she's a lesbian living with her partner is taking her case to a church appeals court.
The Rev. Irene Elizabeth Stroud, of Philadelphia, was ousted Dec. 2 for violating the United Methodist Church's law against "self-avowed practicing homosexuals" in the clergy.
She decided last week to appeal but delayed the announcement until after Christmas weekend: Notice of appeal must be filed this week.
Stroud said she hesitated to appeal because she's tired and dislikes being in the spotlight, but "there are questions the larger church needs to discuss and wrestle with."
She said one factor in her decision was something retired Bishop Joseph Yeakel, the judge who presided at her church trial, said to her after the verdict. Yeakel told Stroud "the day will come when the church apologizes for this decision."
Stroud was tried by her own Eastern Pennsylvania Conference. The case now goes to an appeals panel of the Northeastern Jurisdiction, which covers 12 states and the District of Columbia.
At the trial, Yeakel barred testimony from six Stroud witnesses who oppose the Methodist ban, citing both legal and theological arguments. But the six filed material that is part of the trial record and the Northeastern Jurisdiction will review that.
Stroud wants the appeals panel to consider that Methodist law, known as the Book of Discipline, "calls us a church to stand against every form of discrimination" and "treat all people as equally loved by God."
"When you look at those provisions of the Discipline and some of the prohibitions on homosexuality, you have to make a choice," she said. The six witnesses' filings made similar points.
If the Northeastern Jurisdiction decides trial procedures were mistaken, it could direct a second Pennsylvania trial, Yeakel said. It could also refer questions on interpretation of Methodist law to the church's national Judicial Council.
The case originated last year when Stroud announced her same-sex partnership in a sermon. At the trial, an all-clergy jury voted 12-1 that she was guilty of violating Methodist law. In a subsequent penalty phase, jurors voted to defrock her by 7-6.
Stroud is one of three homosexual clergy members tried since the Methodist General Conference passed its gay ban in 1984. The Rev. Rose Mary Denman of New Hampshire was defrocked in 1987 and the Rev. Karen Dammann of Washington state was acquitted last March.
Philadelphia's First United Methodist Church of Germantown has continued to employ Stroud as a lay worker.
by Gatito Grande » Wed Dec 29, 2004 4:33 pm
) is on tonight, on many PBS stations. Out
[Specially love (not) the district superintendant who's all respectful and supportive of Beth's "integrity" . . . while he's stabbing her in the back. Every single one of these "Oh, I just HATE having to do this to Beth!" {sniff!} types could find their own lost integrity, and REFUSE to having anything to do w/ this travesty? But oh no: they won't put their own (straight) arses on the line---not for this dyke. 
] by Sheridan » Thu Dec 30, 2004 3:55 am
Willow: ...I have to tell you....
Tara: No, I understand you have to be with the person you l-love
Willow: I am
by emma peel » Thu Dec 30, 2004 10:56 pm
by Gatito Grande » Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:20 am
, but he did supposedly say that most of the places hit by the tsunami were "rife w/ sin" or something like that. Out by Sheridan » Fri Dec 31, 2004 3:58 am
Willow: ...I have to tell you....
Tara: No, I understand you have to be with the person you l-love
Willow: I am
by Warduke » Fri Jan 14, 2005 10:23 pm
Quote:
Lutherans Compromise on Gays in the Clergy
By Larry B. Stammer Times Staff Writer
Underscoring deep divisions in the nation's largest Lutheran denomination, a task force on Thursday called for retaining the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America's prohibition against ordaining noncelibate homosexuals, but urged caution in disciplining congregations and clergy who ignored the ban.
At the same time, the church's Task Force for ELCA Studies on Sexuality called for no change in the denomination's practice of permitting local congregations to decide whether to bless the unions of same-sex couples.
The matter will be up to the Churchwide Assembly, the 5-million member denomination's highest legislative body, to act on the panel's recommendations in August.
Church leaders said Thursday's compromise recommendations were aimed at avoiding the divisions that came to a head last year in the worldwide Anglican Communion. In that case, the Episcopal Church ordained an openly gay priest in a committed same-sex relationship as Episcopal bishop of New Hampshire. In response, some other Anglican national churches in Africa, Southeast Asia and South America broke or downgraded their ties with the Episcopal Church, the self-governing U.S. branch of Anglicanism.
In the last year, three Evangelical Lutheran congregations, including two in Southern California, have defied church law by hiring gay and lesbian ministers in committed same-sex relationships. Two of the congregations, Hollywood Lutheran Church and Bethany Lutheran Church in Minneapolis, received letters of censure from their bishops. But a third congregation, Central City Lutheran Mission in San Bernardino, was stripped of its congregational status by the Pacifica Synod Council after hiring a lesbian minister who was in a committed same-sex relationship.
In its report, the Lutheran task force said that unity was as vital as a stand on sexual issues. "The God-given mission and communion we share is at least as important as the issues about which faithful, conscience-bound Lutherans find themselves so decisively at odds," the task force said.
The panel consulted widely with the Lutheran World Federation, the ELCA's ecumenical partners, and other Christian churches. The national task force said that after nearly four years of "painful and difficult" work, it hoped that local synods would consider a "pastoral response" instead of discipline to those who broke the church law.
"As a pastoral response to the deep divisions among us, this church may choose to refrain from disciplining those who in good conscience, and for the sake of outreach, ministry, and the commitment to continuing dialogue, call or approve partnered gay or lesbian candidates whom they believe to be otherwise in compliance [with church] expectations, and to refrain from disciplining [clergy] so approved and called," the task force recommendation said.
The task force conceded that a biblical and theological case for changing ordination standards had not been made to a majority of participants. But it said room had to be allowed for conscience.
It remained to be seen how successful the panel's approach would be if its recommendations were adopted by the Churchwide Assembly. The national church allows celibate homosexuals in the ministry.
One conservative Lutheran leader said that schism could result from a failure to take what he called a biblical stand on homosexuality. "This would mean that the ELCA has no authoritative teaching on sexual ethics and that it has no common agreement on ordination," Robert Benne, director of the Center for Religion and Society at Roanoke College in Salem, Va., said in a prepared statement.
But in an interview, Benne said an open split might have been avoided by the task force's decision to stop short of endorsing the blessing of same-sex unions and the ordination of gays and lesbians in committed relationships. "That would, indeed, split the church," Benne said.
Emily Eastwood, spokeswoman for the Lutheran Alliance for Full Participation, said the six gay and lesbian advocacy groups that make up her organization were "saddened and dismayed" by the recommendations. "We feel they perpetuate a system of selective discrimination against gay and lesbian persons in committed relationships, and those called to ministry," she said in a telephone interview from Chicago.
The recommendations were also greeted cautiously by the Rev. Daniel M. Hooper, pastor of Hollywood Lutheran Church. He said that although allowing local congregations and area synods to approve the ordination and placement of gay pastors was "somewhat helpful," he had hoped the task force would have done more to call for full inclusion of gay men and lesbians in the church's ordained clergy.
He also questioned retaining a church law that was not enforced. "We know from civil law that it's really not a good idea to have laws on the books that no one wants to enforce," Hooper said. Hooper said he had been in a committed same-sex relationship for 28 years.
The ELCA is a separate denomination from the more conservative Lutheran Church — Missouri Synod.
by Gatito Grande » Mon Jan 24, 2005 1:20 am
).
). In Bishop Salmon's published comments, there is this breathtakingly nonsensical gem (quoted here):Quote:
I listened on the 23rd of August to a show that Oprah Winfrey had, and she was interviewing Cameron Diaz, and Cameron was saying, "I don't have a dog," and what she meant by that was that dogs were too much trouble. She had a cat. And then the conversation went to relationships, and Cameron said that she was not willing to make a long-term relationship with anybody -- I'm paraphrasing now -- that she only went this way one time and that she was not wiling to do that. And Oprah said, "How exciting; how revolutionary." And she said, "I'm not willing to make long-term commitments," and she said marriage was a wonderful institution in the past, but she said, "We are emerging as a new species, and I'm not willing to make a commitment for 10 years or 30 years." What that says is that there is a new value there, and that new value is the self, and what is acceptable and what is right is what I want.
Out
by russ » Mon Jan 24, 2005 7:36 am
Quote:
The Africans' statement also indicated that primates of the global south would disregard the commission's recommendation that they stop providing episcopal oversight to dissenting parishes outside their jurisdictions.-- "Africans will not apologize for interfering," Anglican journal, Dec. 2004.
Russ
When we love and give it everything we've got, no matter what the consequences, we are doing what we were put here to do -- Geneen Roth
by skittles » Mon Jan 24, 2005 9:04 am
Quote:
It is wrong for the Church, which worships the God of love, to deny its blessing to those who wish to dedicate their lives together in love. If the Canadian Church is to be faithful to its vision, we must act to bring about justice. This may mean condemnation and isolation from other parts of the Communion, but we must answer the question: "Is unity more important than doing what is right?"
skittles
"The problem with political jokes is how often they get elected."
"Closed minds always seem to be connected to open mouths"
by Gatito Grande » Fri Feb 25, 2005 12:36 am
)Quote:
Church faces schism today
Canada and US to leave over stance on gays
Stephen Bate, religious affairs correspondent
Friday February 25, 2005
The Guardian
The worldwide Anglican communion was heading for an unprecedented schism last night as its member churches in the US and Canada were asked to withdraw from intercommunal gatherings following the rift over homosexuality.
In a six-page communique, issued late last night following earlier leaks to the Guardian and other newspapers, the primates of the 78 million-strong Anglican church, attending a meeting in Northern Ireland, agreed to call upon the US and Canadian churches to withdraw voluntarily for at least three years.
Their representatives will not be invited to church meetings for that period. It was unclear whether the churches will be offered a form of associate or lesser status in the communion in the meantime.
The statement said that "in order to recognise the integrity of all parties" the archbishops requested that the two churches withdraw their members from meetings of the joint Anglican Consultative Council.
They will be asked at their next synods to consider their future place within the worldwide communion.
The North Americans have precipitated the split because of their progressive stance on homosexuality, still regarded as anathema in many other parts of the communion, particularly in the developing world.
In 2003, the US Episcopal Church (Ecusa) endorsed the election of an openly gay bishop, Gene Robinson, in the diocese of New Hampshire. At the same time, the diocese of New Westminster in Vancouver, Canada, became the first in the communion to introduce a service of blessing for same sex couples.
The church's decision follows intensive discussions between 35 of the 38 primates of the Anglican churches' provinces across the world during a five-day meeting at a country mansion at Dromantine near Newry. It effectively splits the third biggest Christian denomination, which has the Church of England as its mother church.
Conservatives and traditionalists had been demanding that the liberal North Ameri can churches be punished unless they withdrew or publicly repented their actions over the gay issue.
It appeared clear that, although the statement does not go that far, it represents a victory for those demanding that the church should stick to its agreed, Bible-based line on homosexuality.
[GG: {sarcasm mode} I just love this part] Last night the leading critic of the Americans and Canadians, Archbishop Peter Akinola of Nigeria, was said to be entertaining his supporters and the traditionalist American and English evangelicals, who have been circling the meeting semi-clandestinely all week, at what was described as a "celebratory" party, paid for by the Americans. [Motherf*ckin' phobes!
One of those in attendance was expected to be the US Episcopal bishop Bob Duncan of Pittsburgh, who has led the opposition and has been staying locally, apparently holidaying in Newry in February.
The statement calls on Dr Rowan Williams, the Archbishop of Canterbury, to set up a panel of reference to supervise the pastoral provision of parishes which have fallen out with their bishops over the issue of homosexuality and says that traditionalist bishops will be discouraged from intervening in diocesan disputes in other jurisdictions.
It also says that the church will now take seriously the long-called-for and promised process of listening to gay and lesbian people and hearing their concerns. It adds that any victimisation or diminishment of gay people is anathema: "Homosexual people are children of God, loved and valued by him and deserving of the best we can give of pastoral care and friendship." [GG's translation: "There, there: you can turn straight (don't think we're going to let your sinful representatives sit down at the same Table-of-the-Lord w/ *us*, though!)"]
In the meantime it expects all primates to exercise their best influence to impose a moratorium on same sex blessings and the consecration of any bishops "living in a sexual relationship outside marriage".
The recommendations are generally in line with those in last October's Windsor report, which was drawn up by a commission of senior church representatives under the chairmanship of Archbishop Robin Eames, the primate of All Ireland.
It has been evident during this week's meeting that neither side was prepared to back down or compromise. The mood of the meeting was described as quiet and sombre, with Dr Rowan Williams, who chaired it, said to be resigned to the division.
Evidently, while the traditionalists have succeeded in their aim of "punishing" the Canadians and Americans, the meeting tried to meet some of the progressives' concerns and left the door open to future reconciliation.
A senior English church source said: "No one has been pushed out yet and no one has walked out."
Out by WebWarlock » Wed Mar 09, 2005 12:22 pm
Web Warlock, web.warlock@comcast.net, The Other Side.
Liber Mysterium: The D20 Netbook of Witches & The Dragon and the Phoenix: New Adventures of Willow and Tara
"We’re gonna light up the dark of night like the brightest day in a whole new way."
by DaddyCatALSO » Wed Mar 09, 2005 4:14 pm
by russ » Wed Mar 09, 2005 5:16 pm
Russ
When we love and give it everything we've got, no matter what the consequences, we are doing what we were put here to do -- Geneen Roth
by Gatito Grande » Wed Mar 09, 2005 11:42 pm
by Warduke » Wed Mar 23, 2005 9:48 pm
Quote:
Scottish Episcopalians OK Gay Priests
LONDON - Being a practicing homosexual is no bar to becoming a priest, the Scottish Episcopal Church says, a stance that puts it at odds with the Anglican Communion in other parts of the world.
In a response to a February meeting of 35 top world Anglican leaders, posted on the church Web site, the College of Bishops of the Scottish Episcopal Church said it had "never regarded the fact that someone was in a close relationship with a member of the same sex as in itself constituting a bar to the exercise of an ordained ministry."
The bishops also said clergy on occasion responded to requests to give a blessing to same-sex couples.
It is believed to be the first time the Scottish church has publicly declared their position on gay clergy and blessings of homosexual couples, which have long been unwritten but commonly held acceptances.
The announcement comes at a delicate time for Anglicans worldwide and is in contrast to the Scottish Episcopal Church's sister body, the Church of England, which will ordain homosexuals only if they are not in a physical relationship.
At last month's crisis meeting of Anglican leaders in Northern Ireland, the issue of homosexuality threatened to split the international Anglican Communion.
Anglican leaders, meeting near Belfast, asked the U.S. Episcopal Church and the Anglican Church of Canada to withdraw from the Anglican Consultative Council (ACC) for three years — a move some fear could be the first step toward a permanent split in the communion.
The two churches were also invited to explain to the council in June the theological reasoning behind the consecration of V. Gene Robinson as Bishop of New Hampshire and the decision by one Canadian diocese to authorize the blessing of same sex unions.
The Scottish bishops expressed regret at the decision to request the withdrawal of U.S. and Canadian Churches from the ACC.
"We are conscious that as a church we are much indebted in our life both to a significant presence of persons of homosexual orientation, and also those whose theology and stance would be critical of attitudes to sexuality other than abstinence outside marriage."
"We rejoice in both," the bishops' response said.
by Gatito Grande » Wed Mar 23, 2005 10:23 pm
). ) for Scotland the Brave! 
Out
by russ » Thu Mar 24, 2005 5:34 am
Russ
When we love and give it everything we've got, no matter what the consequences, we are doing what we were put here to do -- Geneen Roth
by AmbersSecretAdmirer » Thu Mar 24, 2005 10:02 am
Tara & Willow Together Forever!!! Blessed Be Eternally!!!
by Gatito Grande » Mon Apr 04, 2005 6:27 pm
Quote:
Maida's touch
By Sean Kosofsky
Originally printed 3-23-04 (Issue 1312)
[Note: the article came out before the Pope's illness(es) turned fatal---but that's a misprint, above: it should say "3-23-05"]
What is going on with the Roman Catholic Church? Cardinal Adam Maida, who leads the Archdiocese of Detroit, is turning seventy-five, which means he is required to jump ship and submit his resignation. The Pope is expected to not accept the resignation and keep him on, wreaking havoc on fair-minded citizens of Michigan.
For those of you unfamiliar with Maida's record on GLBT issues, let me just say that he has become the single largest funder and advocate of anti-gay campaigns in Michigan history. While presiding over a million Catholics in Michigan, he has gone from silent and unapproachable to recklessly wicked and unapproachable.
I have never seen so many people leave the Roman Catholic Church as I have in the past six months. This happened because Maida and the Michigan Catholic Conference slammed the door in the face of gay couples. Each Diocese in Michigan donated a combined total of nearly a million dollars to pass Proposal 2, the anti-marriage constitutional amendment. How can they rationalize this while shutting down schools and churches due to a lack of funds? It's as if Maida is saying, "We are just so broke. We can't afford schooling or services for the poor, but we do have a secret stash of money for the sole purpose of locking gay couples out of health insurance, hospital visitation and emergency medical decisions for their loved ones."
Maida also single-handedly blocked the Michigan Catholic Conference from endorsing pro-GLBT hate crime legislation in Michigan back in 1998. Maida has also responded with deafening silence to numerous requests to meet from the GLBT community. He has ignored every request, run away from any opportunities for discussion, and waged a fantastically financed campaign to blame skyrocketing divorce rates on queers.
Sound like leadership and compassion? It sounds more like arrogance, bigotry and hypocrisy. That is Maida's Touch.
Let me also state that I am a recovering Catholic myself. I say that tongue-in-cheek but I left the Catholic Church in order to stay alive. I struggled with my sexual orientation since I was nine. By the time I was fourteen I needed to find a way out of the Church. I felt it was telling me I was crap. I left the Church because I instinctively knew I was worth more than they said I was. I almost took my own life on two separate occasions and consider myself lucky. Countless others have killed themselves because their faith tradition shoved them into the closet and blamed the problems of society on them. It is pathetic and angers me just thinking about it.
For those of you who are mad that I am taking aim at Cardinal Maida, stop being so defensive. Catholics who support equality and justice need to stop apologizing for the Church's mistakes and start demanding change. We have a responsibility to challenge so-called "moral leaders" when they claim that discrimination and bias are simply age-old "values." They are not tradition, they are relics. They should be tossed in the trash and traded in for new, bright and shiny traditions based on love, fairness and inclusion.
Maybe when Cardinal Maida and the Roman Catholic Church start catching up with the times they will find the flock they lost so steadily over the years. The problem isn't with their faith or religion, it is the way it touches its members and society at large. Far from being gentle, Maida has an iron grip. And you can't shake hands with a clenched fist. Maida should just resign. Not because he is old, but because he is out of touch.
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