Top 10 shows of all time

[Thespia]

Also in no particular order:



Hogan's Heroes

The Cosby Show

Charlie's Angels (seasons with Sabrina)

Murphy Brown

Seinfeld

Bewitched

One foot in the grave

Ally McBeal (First seasons)

X-Files (Seasons 1 to 5)

The Simpsons



I tend to remember shows that aren't running anymore. But I also love Gilmore Girls and should mention one eleventh favorite: Mad about you. Love Paul, Jamie, Lisa, Debbie and everyone.

[Big Dummy]

Hmm...I'm gonna have to do this in chronological order(more or less). Since I was rarely a loyal fan of a show, I count my all-time faves as those that I absolutely hated to miss an episode for (and didn't, if I could help it)



Kate and Allie

Voltron

Robotech (The New Generation)

Jem

Degrassi Junior High(the original)

Star Trek TNG (pre-Tasha Yar death)

Twin Peaks

Dawson's Creek (the Pacey/Joey Season)

X-Files

BtVS

[JJtheCool]

I'm sure a lot of good TV will be off my list as I rarely watch it anymore save for news & sports but here goes (INPO).



Battle of the Planets (70's Anime - Remember the Phoenix?)

The Wallace & Ladmo Show (longest continuous running kids show in US)

Battlestar Galactica

The Dick Van Dyke Show (watched it every summer in reruns)

M*A*S*H

The Cosby Show

Family Ties

Cheers

St. Elsewhere

Kate & Allie

Newhart

Star Trek (the whole franchise)

Mystery - The Adventures of Sherlock Holmes (hosted by Emma Peel herself)

The Simpsons

Muscle (early WB show)

Friends

The X-Files

Buffy (up until you-know-what)



Yeah, that's more than ten. So sue me!

JJtheCool

---

*Sigh*

Edited by: JJtheCool  at: 2/8/04 2:21 am

[Scarecrow]

Hmm...



Hard to do a Top 10 but 10 shows that REALLY impress me:



10. Red Dwarf

9. The League of Gentlemen

8. Blakes 7

7. Babylon 5

6. Farscape

5. Stargate SG-1

4. Father Ted

3. Buffy - until the very end of the episode after OMWF. The one which end swith the song lyrics "say goodbye to everything you knew". Damn, was that accurate...

2. Queer as Folk



And, though they weren't in any orde ror even really my be all and end all top 10, this IS my fave.



DOCTOR WHO



40 years and going strong. Thw show may have ended in 1989 but with monthly novels and audio plays it never really left.



AND it's Finally coming back! 2005 - Doctor Who returns. Anyone else notice I'm excited?



- Scarecrow

"Everything is turning out so dark"

Edited by: Scarecrow at: 2/10/04 2:44 pm

[KiwiAlcyone]

How could anyone not be excited about Doctor Who coming back!...well, unless you hate the show of course Yay, I only hope they get someone cool to play him...he doesnt have to be really sexy...just cool. And the red telephone box please!



And the Doctor did beat all the Buffy characters in the SFX poll for the coolest sci-fi character of all time...so there are lots of Doctor fans out there!



-Alcy

“It’s just my imagination. Some people have flat feet. Some people have dandruff. I have this appalling imagination…”

The Seven Year Itch.

[ivygort]

10: Roy Rogers and Dale Evans Love the horses and the beautiful woman!

9: Mission Impossible Barbara Bain? Enough Said.

8: Beauty and the Beast Season Three with Diana. Beautiful woman, wonderful acting, great writing.

7: Buffy the Vampire Slayer Seasons one through four

6: The X-Files Scully!

5:Mod Squad Sixties version.

4:The Cosby Show

3:Joan of Arcadia If the show ended tomorrow I still cherish every tape and every episode.

2: Xena

1: Babylon Five Everything I needed to know about Bush and Homeland security, I learned from President Clark and Nightwatch.



Was on the list but am pending the outcome of the next two shows--Stargate SG-1--so long.

Edited by: ivygort at: 2/10/04 9:19 pm

[Boomstick79]

Hmm, this was a lot more difficult to do than I thought it would be, I don't tend to watch much TV with my job being the daft hours it is but I did use to be a big TV fan a few years back. In no particular order here are my favourite Top Ten TV shows: (subject to change hehehe)



Buffy The Vampire Slayer -I was a late convert to the show, starting only to really watch from Season 4, but still one of the most consistently enjoyable shows on TV.



Drop the Dead Donkey - Topical British satirical show set at Globelink news, with some of the best comedy characters ever written. Joy Merriweather anyone?



Dungeons and Dragons - I still love this cartoon and I'm 24 now. I used to watch avidly every week when I was at primary school and still have some videos my dad taped oiff the TV for me from way back in 1984. Some of the best background music ever on TV and I so wanted to be Diana the acrobat when I was a kid it was ridiculous



MASH - Bittersweet, moving and wonderfully funny. Reminds me of being at scholl and watching with my dad. Bantering doctors, Hawkeye and BJ and the inimitable Maj. Charles Emerson Winchester III. Very cool.



24 - Groundbreaking and compulsively watchable.



Ultraviolet - 6 part British TV series about a special police unit designed to hunt vampires. I so wish they made a second season, it was a great show



At home with the Braithwaites - Virginia is all I need to watch this show. Bloody hilarious!



Telebugs - Weird British TV show about three robots with TVs for heads. Wonderfully naff, with two wicked villains, Angel Brain and my favourite Zudo Bug. Spawned the phrase: "Evil OK! Evil OK!!" and reminds me of growing up with my best mate and watching the show at his house after school



This Life - Anna!



Blackadder goes forth - One of the first things I remember crying over on TV was the final episode when they finally go 'over the top' and the scene fades to poppy fields. I do like the other Blackadders but Squadron Leader the Lord Flasheart sticks in my mind from this season



~Lou

[kukalaka]

I actually try to stay away from most series as I'm a "I either watch all of it or I don't watch at all"-person. And I just don't want to spend too much of my time watching TV.



Star Trek TNG and DS9 in that order with TNG having the unfair advantage of being the first series that really hooked me.



Coupling (I think there is a US remake now, but I don't mean that.) That series just makes me laugh my a.. off.





Some Buffy: I love a lot of the dialogues, I love Willow and, of course, I love W/T.



Some ER: I gave it a try because of K/K, but damn that Abby is cute.



Some 24 even though they tried too hard to be unpredictable in the end. Big plotholes. I'm not going too watch season 2 as they managed to ruin my favourite character.





And I used to love Superman - The Adventures of Lois and Clark.



Oh, and on German TV McGyer was on right before Star Trek for a long time, so I know all the endings and all of the little tricks he did

[justin]

Here are what I think are the top ten British series ever made, not really in any order



Red Dwarf

The Goodies

Blake's 7

Randal & Hopkirk, deceased (The origional version, not the recent remake)

Monty Pythons Flying Circus

U.F.O

The Saint (The Roger Moore version)

Doctor Who

The Prisoner

The Avengers (The Diana Rigg years)

Postel's Prescription: Be generous in what you accept, rigorous in what you emit.

[Ginner WTluv]

Quote:

---

At home with the Braithwaites - Virginia is all I need to watch this show. Bloody hilarious!

---

I can't believe i left this one out!! I love this show. And yeah, Virginia is all i watch the show for. Sarah Smart is just soooooo funny!! Damn it, they need to bring this show back.



~ Jen

Helen - Oh please Nikki, be serious!

Nikki - I want to make love you to all night long... is that serious enough?

** Helen and Nikki in "Bad Girls" **

[Pale dreamer]

in no particular order



buffy - of course

ER

six feet under - brenda is so yummy

the simpsons

ab fab

sex and the city - cant believe its nearly over

bad girls - only some times though

at home with the braithwaites - love it

red dwarf

friends - maybe only because its the last series



hmmmm now i want to watch at home with the braithwaites, does anybody know if there will be another series?? please say yes im begging you

[urnofosiris]

I edited my post to include Joan of Arcadia at no.3

The best new show in years.

[shivermetimbers]

Here's my slightly embarrassing 2 cents worth



1. Buffy : great writing, great acting, nice shots



2. The Simpsons: this is as funny as it gets folks



3. China Beach: early seasons were wrentching, amazing acting, and Marg Helegenberger, mmm



4. The Family Guy: actually this might be as funny as it gets in a totally wrong, king of way



5. Beauty and the Beast: it was nice to see something so soft on primetime, except for when Vincent was ripping his claws into the baddies



6. Star Trek: the Next Generation: great writing, Gates McFadden began my redhead obsession



7. My So Called Life: so true it made the truth slightly less akward



8. The X Files: every Sunday night of my life a party for the first 5 years at least



9. The Tomorrow People (early version): I used to watch the Nick reruns back in the early 80s over and over and over again, so began my fascination with sci-fi and psi



10. Macgruder and Loud: I defy anyone to remember this show. It ran for less than a season in 1984. Husband. Wife. Cops. Great chemistry between the leads: Kathryn Harrold and John Getz. I was 8 and I used to "play" this show with the neighborhood kids all the time. Jenny Loud was so much cooler than the jiggly Charlie's Angels chicks.



I just noticed a very disturbing pattern. Note the redheads:

Alyson Hannigan as Willow

Marg Helgenberger as KC

Gates McFadden as Beverly Crusher

Gillian Anderson as Dana Scully

Claire Danes as Angela Chase

Hell, even Lois from the Family Guy is a redhead



The first step is admitting you have a problem

"All of the world is designed to remind you, all of the love you can find, is inside, under all of the noise, here's your chance to be overjoyed" - Christine Kane

[Gatito Grande]

"I just noticed a very disturbing pattern. Note the redheads:"



Oh yeah, right there w/ you shiver. But where's [Kittens sigh, collectively. Don't tell me GG's gonna blather on about Xena Warrior Princess yet again? ] Gabrielle?

Quote:

---

Apex: “No matter, my dear. You’re sure to win his heart;

you’re the right type. Just look around you. As you can see,

we have a long tradition of making innocuous blue-eyed blondes

our Queen.”



Gabrielle: “Yeah, well [laughs], I’m more of a redhead, really."

---

Blind Faith, Season 2



GG Is it possible to love a TV show too much? It's GG's life-long project to find out! Out

[sheila wt]

That wasn't as easy as I thought...



1 - Babylon 5 (seasons 1-4, best sci-fi epic ever!)

2 - Buffy (until everybody went brain dead, and I don't mean Tara...)

3 - Golden Girls (forever!)

4 - Northern Exposure (on DVD soon!!!)

5 - The Bionic Woman (what can I say? Lindsay Wagner did wonders for the dreams of young Sheila )

6 - The Beauty and the Beast (Linda Hamilton, yum... and so romantic!)

7 - Bad Girls (very different and darkly funny)

8 - Xena (I don't need to comment on this one...)

9 - Any Day Now (such a great way to deal with so many important issues)

10 - Space 1999 (godess, I'm old...)



But, if I have to be completely honest, in our home the most watched shows are all from HGTV. We just love "Subterraneans", "Mission Organization", "Curb Appeal", "Extreme Homes", "Design on a Dime", "Designing Cents", "Ground Rules!" and "Restore America". We also love "Ground Force" from BBCAmerica.

--------------------------
"She had tasted Willow on her tongue, and she had worn Willow on her skin. There wasn't a shower in the world that could have washed that away." (Terra Firma, by Tulipp)

[Tiggrscorpio]

shivermetimbers, I remember Macgruder and Loud very well. I had such a crush on Kathryn Harrold. It was a pretty good show that unfortunately didn't last too long.

*****



"The history of our nation has demonstrated that separate is seldom, if ever, equal." The Massachusetts Supreme Court upholding its ruling in favor of gay marriage

[bowieinberlin]

Here's my 10 favorites:



Dr. Who -- I often wished Tom Baker was my dad.

That '70s Show -- Not so much these days, but the first few seasons were fantastic

Sex and the City -- I was mad when I got hooked on this show... but dammit, I love it

The Simpsons -- 'Nuff said

Ab Fab -- Finally, a reason to get drunk and do lots of drugs

Buffy -- It was the dialogue that sucked me in, the poor plot construction that drove me away

The League of Gentlemen -- "There's this part with the vet and he shoots the shell off a turtle with oxygen..."

Twin Peaks -- "Wow, Bob, wow." "Through the darkness of futures past, a magician longs to see ... " and "My log does not judge!"

Family Guy -- So funny it hurts. See the episode "Wasted Talent." The ChumbaWumbas kill me.

Curb Your Enthusiasm -- I AM LARRY DAVID!

[Firefoot]

In more or less chronological order of when I was watching them:



Dr. Who

Robin of Sherwood

The Simpsons

The X-Files (1st 5 seasons)

Anamaniacs/ Pinky & the Brain

Xena (1st 2 seasons)/ Hercules (seasons 2-5)

Buffy (through "Tabula Rasa"; Spuffy and Crack Addict Willow just lost me)/ Angel (through "Blind Date"; it was never the same after Lindsey took off)

The West Wing (1st 2 seasons)

Kim Possible (only thing currently on the viewing menu)



I know that's 12 shows--I'm cheating.



Firefoot

-----

"The holy passion of friendship is of so sweet and steady and loyal and enduring a nature that it will last for a whole lifetime, if not asked to lend money."

--Mark Twain

[Triscuit7]

Number One for me wasn't difficult



1. The Avengers (Diana Rigg ... and Linda Thorson)



But the rest ... this ain't easy and the list's not in any particular order - and yeah, I know I'm dating myself



MASH

Hill Street Blues

Star Trek (TOS)

Star Trek (DS9)

Monty Python's Flying Circus

St. Elsewhere

Dr. Who (particularly Jon Pertwee)

Lassie

Charlie's Angels



Favorite new shows:

Queer Eye for the Straight Guy

Joan of Arcadia



Honorable Mentions:

Xena

Hercules

BTVS

The New Avengers



Ciao, Melissa

******************



Do something totally irrational and let the enemy think himself to death. (Pyanfar Chanur)

[The Smee]

You're not going to get any order from me.



Except for this:

#1: SPACED - a great little British geek series. Probably my favourite here.



10 others that I can think of while I'm writing this:



Twin Peaks

South Park

The League of Gentlemen

The Dead Zone

The Office

Futurama

Monk

Star Trek (Kirk, Picard and Sisco, and I know that's cheating)

Dr. Who

And of course, Monty Python's Flying Circus.

This has been a message brought to you by SmeeCorp.

[shivermetimbers]

Hey wow, another Kathyrn Harrold fan. She's been in a ton of stuff. I find it hard to belive she's never really become "known". Did you watch her in The Bronx Zoo? It was on the air immediately post-Macgruder and Loud.



The show itself was pretty good. I loved the fake wall between Jenny and Malcom's apartments.

"All of the world is designed to remind you, all of the love you can find, is inside, under all of the noise, here's your chance to be overjoyed" - Christine Kane

[WebWarlock]

Notice what is not on the list.



www.chicagotribune.com/fe...genews-utl

Quote:

---

Top 25 TV: 'Lucy' leads the pack

By Allan Johnson

Tribune staff reporter

Published March 18, 2004



If you're going to work in the television industry, you should have a working knowledge of some TV shows. But which ones?



The television department of Columbia College Chicago -- of which this reporter is an instructor -- has come up with a list it feels will be helpful to its TV majors (as well as everyone else, those at the college contend). But the list promises to spark controversy and second-guessing among most television fans.



"The 25 Television Shows that TV Majors Should Know," revealed today, is a list of what the TV department believes are "the most important TV shows in our history," according to a release, as well as programming that "every TV department student [should] have seen by the time they graduate."



"If we expect them to make the quality of shows, and redefine the medium as we expect them to, then they need to have this baseline understanding of where TV comes from and why it is the way it is," said Michael Niederman, chairman of Columbia's TV department.



The 25 Television Shows that TV Majors Should Know (and Pretty Much Everybody Else)



1. "I Love Lucy"

2. "Toast of the Town"/ "The Ed Sullivan Show"

3. "Dragnet"

4. "Your Show of Shows"

5. "See It Now"

6. "Gunsmoke"

7. "American Bandstand"

8. "Perry Mason"

9. "The Tonight Show"

10. "The Twilight Zone"

11. "The Dick Van Dyke Show"

12. "The Beverly Hillbillies"

13. "Star Trek"

14. "Monty Python's Flying Circus"

15. "Rowan & Martin's Laugh-In"

16. "All in the Family"

17. "The Mary Tyler Moore Show"

18. "Donahue"

19. "ABC Monday Night Football"

20. "60 Minutes"

21. "Hill Street Blues"

22. "The Cosby Show"

23. "The Simpsons"

24. "Seinfeld"

25. "The Sopranos"



Source: Columbia College, Chicago

---

Warlock

-----

Web Warlock

Coming Soon to The Other Side, The Netbook of Shadows: A Book of Spells for d20 Witches

"Razzle, dazzle, drazzle, drone, time for this one to come home." - The Replacements, "Hold My Life"

[sam7777]

Those are the shows that will be remebered 5, 10 amd more years from now and are not a flash in the pan. There is so much talk of shows being "groundbreaking" and/or "cultural phenomenon" with "genius" creators but the true test is that of time.

_____________________

I still see dead lesbian cliches

[undertarasspell]

Don't know about all time but ones I like at the moment are:

BtVS (Seasons 1-5)

Charmed

The O.C.

Father Ted

Footballers Wives (don't laugh, I only watch it to laugh at how ridiculous it is )

Red Dwarf

Angel

Coupling

----------------

I've never seen blood and dessert go together so well. - Amber Benson

[Gatito Grande]

Hmmm: not what I would have picked (even if I could forgive them for not listing Xena, but whatever). The Beverly Hillbillies? American Bandstand? The Cosby Show? Eh.



GG I see why they want to list "first of a type" (aka ground-breaking), but it's still too (waaaaay-) back-loaded for my tastes . . . and I'm one of the older Kittens here! Out

[0 CaliSto 0]

1) xena, love xena, love gab, love to **** alti

2) buffy, season 1 - 6 inclusive

3) Ruby Wax meets, so funny

4) What not to wear, trinny and suzannah bitchiness at its best

5) golden girls, dorothys sarcasm

6) Sybil, christine baranski is class

7) Room 101

8) Tipping the Velvet, tv adaptation

9) Have I got news for you

10) Charlies Angels, Sabrina kicked ass

Edited by: 0 CaliSto 0 at: 3/21/04 8:30 am

[darkmagicwillow]

I don't think I can come up with 10 TV shows that I love, so here's my top 4:



1. B5, perhaps the best plotted series ever

2. BtVS

3. Daria, the best animated series ever

4. Farscape



Joan of Arcadia is good, and might make the list if it continues at the same level. No other current shows seem to be of that quality level, though I've heard 24 is good and I borrowed the DVDs of the first season this week.



The Simpsons was an excellent show once upon a time, but has continued long past its expiration date. Futurama never made it to the same level as The Simpsons. Family Guy can be good when they focus on Stewie, but the other characters are less interesting. However, Invader:Zim is excellent and deserves an honorable mention in the animated category.



The Star Trek series were a poor excuse for SF overall, though Star Trek DS9 started to develop a coherent story in its later seasons. Red Dwarf is fun, but I haven't seen enough of the episodes to rate the series as a whole. I haven't been impressed by Dr. Who, but again I haven't seen enough episodes to rate it. The first season and a half of Roswell was pretty good, but then SF stopped showing it, so I can't rate that one either. Xena was excellent until the Dahok/Hope storyline came up.

--

"Omnia mutantur, nihil interit." -- "Everything changes, but nothing is truly lost."

[werewolf123]

1.Paladin (existential cowboy)

2.Hec Ramsey

3.Brisco County

3a. Kung Fu



4.Bablyon 5

5.Star trek tos and ds9



6.Harry O (his boat the answer and how he never finished it)

7.Banyon



8.Mary Tyler Moore show.



9. Buffy the vampire slayer (season 1-5)



10. Episodes: Demon with a glass hand, and City on the edge of forever.

Edited by: werewolf123 at: 3/21/04 9:02 pm

[AquarianSky]

These are not what I would necessarily consider to be the 10 Greatest/Best TV Shows of all-time, but they are MY ten favorite shows (subtle distinction)



1. China Beach -- Dana Delany may have been the "star", but Marg Helgenberger stole every scene she was in.



2. Soap -- The funniest show EVER. Still puts me on the floor after all these years.



3. Buffy The Vampire Slayer -- er, years 1-6



4. That 70's Show -- years 1-3.



5. Moonlighting -- What kind of clothes do you suppose would be worn by a man with a mole on his nose?



6. Charlie's Angels -- years 1-3, only. The Angels rocked.



7. Scarecrow & Mrs. King -- I had a big Kate Jackson-thing, obviously.



8. Remington Steele -- Stephanie Zimbalist was utterly adorable! Looked great in hats. And tailored slacks. ;-)



9. Seinfeld -- two words: The Contest



10. Battle of the Network Stars -- Not necessarily coordinated, scantily-clad actors and actresses engaging in athletic competition. That's just good T.V.!!



Also love(d): Laugh-In, The Simpsons, Cagney & Lacey, Mad About You, The CBS Monday night line-up circa 1991 -- Murphy Brown, Designing Women, Northern Exposure; South Park, Roseanne, LA Law, Little House on the Prairie, Bionic Woman, Dallas, Battlestar Gallactica,The Nanny and, of course, The Brady Bunch.



And I remember MacGruder & Loud!! It was kinda absurd (with the adjoining apartments), but I LOVED that show!!! I always think of it when I drive by the apartment building that was used for the exterior shots -- which is still there in Brentwood, CA. (cute building!)

Edited by: AquarianSky at: 3/21/04 11:43 pm

[sam7777]

DMW: "Star Trek" may be a "poor excuse for SF" (though I don't agree with your assessment) but it has done alot for science fact(see below). BTVS was a poor excuse for horror (random magic rules for one) but I still enjoyed some of it though it doesn't make my top ten list (I am only a W/T fan). I agree that DS9 had the best overall story arc of all the Treks though I like the early seasons more than the later ones.



GG: I get your dismay that "Top 25 TV shows of all time" list was mostly old shows but consider that it's almost impossible to tell if a show has an impact until some years have gone by. A show really can't have impact for "all time" until some time has passed to give it some time. Looking at the top 10 lists here, we mostly pick current genre shows because that is what we all watch. However, how many of our top ten pickes will still be significant 10,20,30 and even 40-50 years from now. How many shows created by "geniuses" will still be talked about 10 years from now. Impossible to really say at this time though I think "The Sopranos" currently airing is easily one of them.



One example from the list that I would use to illustrate the point is one of the only two genre shows: lucky 13. "Star Trek". Love, hate it or ignore it (and people here have done all three), there's no denying that "Star Trek" is a significant TV show. Trek is still on the air after more than 40 years (although even this rabid trekker stopped watching the latest iteration, Enterprise). Trek has inspired people to study science, people to become astronauts (Mae Jameson) and new technologies. I posted within the last year in the "Star Trek" thread under molded plastic an article by an scientist insprired by trek and one about technologies:

TREK TECH 40 years since the Enterprise's inception, some of its science fiction gadgets are part of everyday life

Mars Was No Bar to Boy With a Dream



Trek has also been a cutural phenomenon. People who have never seen an episode or movie know tag phrases like "beam me up Scotty" and "make it so". Trek pioneered the first interracial kiss on TV and showed women in positions of responsibility in the 60's when this was not the case in general society. As a girl growing up, Trek was the only show on TV that showed women out in a postiion of authirty (as starship officers). I grew up wanting to be Uhura and in fact have served as a signals officer in the army. Trek showed me that women could do whatever men could do when I was growing up. It inspired me to be interested in technology and now my career is in IT.



Trek showed that atheism was not amoral or worse immoral. It showed that a moral system could be imagined without religion. This made a real impact on me when I decided to give up organized religion though I am not an atheist (I'm a non practicing catholic). Prior to Trek atheism and paganism got a bad rap from it's being identified with the SS during WW2. I think that Trek helped to show the good side of atheism and that was another important cultural impact. Trek's optimistic future was inspiring to many and also sickenly sweet to many.



Personally I get rapidly bored with shows that have all cynical, formerly evil or selfish people. That can be as dull as having all paragons and as unimaginative and uninteresting. I think good people can be as interesting as bad people looking for redemption and I like to see some karma. I hate it when people who rape and murder and mildly repent can become good guys. Xena went on a 6 season odyssey to make up for her past sins and realistically was not seen as redeemed by everyone. She was a hero but Gabrielle was even more of a hero for never being evil and just trying to do the best she could in a violent word IMHO. Gabrielle had flaws but she is a hero for me because she never gave in an became evil. That takes more strength and is more laudable IMHO than coming back from evil.



Trek has had an ongoing impact for 40 years and counting. IMHO no other genre show has had that kind of impact on society. IMHO Star Trek belongs in "Top 25 TV shows of all time" list but this is not a determination that I could have made while it was still on or even 10 years after.

_____________________

I still see dead lesbian cliches

Edited by: sam7777  at: 3/22/04 2:16 pm