Have any of you been disowned by family members

[xita]

Megan that's awesome and not corny, much love right back to you and all the kitties.

- - - - - - - - - - - -

"Oooh Xita!" - Amber Benson

[Willowlicious]

I'm so sorry to read about all the horrible, frightening experiences many Kittens have had with their families because they are glbt. I was very lucky with my family. When I finally came out to them at the age of 25, they were a bit freaked out, but mostly because they were frightened for me, not of me. They came around very quickly and, while never involved or educated in larger gay issues per se, they were/are very supportive of me and my relationship with my longterm girlfriend. My father is even careful when he speaks of Doug (my sister's husband) and Patty (my girlfriend). He says things to my sister and I like, "It's up to you and your partners," or "Gather up the spouses and let's go." He refers to them as equals, which I think is very cool.



When my mother died in May, my extended family of aunts, uncles and cousins also treated Patty and I with great respect. It's funny, I've never actually come out to the extended family, but instead just showed up over the years at family events with Patty at my side and people have just quietly figured it out. At first they were too unsure to refer to us as a couple, but that has changed. Me, my father, sister, Patty and Doug all moved as a group at the funeral and people accepted Patty's importance within that group. My aunts and cousins would even steer Patty and I closer together if they deemed that we were standing too far apart to be of proper comfort to one another. It was sweet really. And completely unspoken. But that's okay.



What's interesting though is that, despite all this acceptance, I do still have issues due to my fear of being discovered before I came out. I went to Christian schools that would have expelled me if they'd known I was gay. There was constant pressure to hide my personal life and I wasn't always successful. There was more than one incident in which I was nearly publicly outed and dismissed from school. I was also afraid of what my parents would think of me. I never feared I would be disowned, I thankfully knew that wasn't a possibility. Yet the shame of being discovered was so great that I chose never to speak of my personal life. I chose to keep my deepest feelings of love and desire secret and hidden.



As a result, I find that I'm now used to being overly independent when it comes to personal matters such as love and grief. I am very open with my girlfriend, but I have a hard time sharing my emotions with my family. I find that my sister and father are bonding in the weeks and months after my mother's death, but I can't share my feelings of loss so openly with them. From the ages of 16-25, I taught myself to hide my feelings and to carefully partition my life. And now that I don't need to do that anymore, I find that I can't stop.



Anyway, I'm rambling. I've been lucky. But I've learned that being gay in a hostile society does have the potential to harm each of us, even the lucky ones. And if I have long lasting problems from hiding my identity in a relatively mild environment, my heart truly goes out to those who haven't been as lucky as I have.



You do have a home here.



Amy

--------

"It's a luscious mix of words and tricks that let us bet when we know we should fold."

"Caring Is Creepy" by The Shins

[Aduka]

((Hugs)) to all the other kitties that have posted in this thread.



Anyways when my mom found out I was a lesbian she went psycho, tossed me out of the house(I was 22 at the time) and I had to live w/th my godparents(who didnt care I was gay . It was a little hard b/c bf I was outed my parents and I had had a pretty close relationship, in my mind Id forgiven my parents and had settled into living my life w/th out talking to them. When they suprised me and slowly came around to getting to know me again.



Loong story short, my gf and I now live w/th said parents and its been touch and go; thanks in large part to my gf's very gay friendly family my parents are slowly coming around to accepting us.



However it's still touch and go like I said, Tuesday night my dad got angrey and threatned to throw my gf out of the house, well instead of turning tail and running we dug our toes in and fought!!! (in a good mature way of course And suprise suprise my dad said this afternoon that my gf can stay,I think what really shocked them was my determenation to stand by my gf no matter what.



Anyways much love and **hugs** to kitties still in not good living arrangments, hang in there and never lose heart.

[tarawillow66]

hey! first off i would like to give all the kittens that posted a big huge.and much love . and xita, thanks for being there for me.



thank you for everybodys help and support.i nevr thought that a bounch of people i don't even know could be so helpful. thank you.



much love to you all

megan



"look little green aliens are coming out of your ears."

[alyamber4ever]

Back in February this year I wrote my father a letter telling him I was a lesbian. He then called my older sister and was basically taking out all of his frustrations with my on her. He told her that I'm not his daughter and that my Mom must have slept with someone else....cuz, I wasn't his. He thinks I'm disgusting.

So, since February 12th.....i've had no father.

[melissande]

I just wanted to say how much I respect the courage on display here and wish the best for you all, especially if you're still in a bad situation.



As a straight person, like xita says, I'll never know the daily fear you've gone through. It's literally unimaginable to me and I don't know how you survive it. But I've seen enough gay friends go through familial rejection to be angry as hell about it. How is it so many evil people can cheat on spouses, abandon children, hurt their communities with criminal behavior, or just be hateful jerks, but still enjoy the support and love of their families, while perfectly wonderful people who happen to love others of the same sex are so often disowned? How idiotic is that?



The things people pick to be morally outraged by -- it never ceases to amaze.

[AmySarah]

when i was 15 and still closeted (18 now) i was on the phone with a gay male friend (we pretended to be bf and gf) and we where talking about going out that night to a gay bar. Well my dad was standing behind me and heard the conversation about the bar and when i hung up his exact words where...

"Do u need a lift to the {bar name} tonight? Also i would love to meet any girlfriend that you have. They are always welcome"



On the other hand when i told my mother she completely freeked on me and now refuses to even have me in her house. Too the point at xmas she sends presents to my brother and i dont even get a card.



so i can empathise with both side of the spectrum here.



saz



xo

[kathy94]

I have always had feelings for women but I ignored them for the first two decades of my life. I thought they would go away after time. Two years ago I was married and unhappy and didn’t know why. My husband was a great guy but something just didn’t feel right. I didn't love him as much as I thought I should. I ended up getting involved with a girl that I knew, who lived a few hours away from me, and realized that having a girlfriend was what made me happy. I had never felt before how I felt when I was with her. When she was around I felt like I could do anything and be anything and it was the best feeling in the world



I was so happy that I told all my friends. Most of them didn’t have a problem with it and one of my friends said that she’d known I was gay for 10 years!! I have one friend who I don’t associate with anymore but that’s ok. I was so happy that I even wrote my parents a letter (too chicken to do it in person) and let them know I was gay and that I wanted to start dating women. They told me they had no problem with it. Unfortunately my relationship with my girlfriend ended (we were both married and felt bad being in a relationship while married so decided to break up) but I was still happy because I finally knew what I was missing.



The only problem was, like I said, I was married and my husband didn’t want to divorce me. It took another two years to convince him that it was for the best. Now I’ve been divorced for two weeks and I’m so happy that I’ll be able to find someone special to share my life with. My parents haven’t disowned me, and I feel bad for those of you who have had a hard time with family. I started feeling really good about myself and who I am more after I started reading the Kitten board. I'm so thankful that I we can all be here to support each other. I'm happier single right now than I was married but I can't wait to be as happy as I once was when I had a girlfriend. It's time for me to move on and start dating now and I feel like all of you helped me, because I don't have any gay people. Being on the Kitten board and knowing that I'm not the only one out there who feels this ways helps me alot. Thank you all.



I’m here if anyone ever needs to talk



Yahoo IM: teamo94

MSN IM: kmeyer76

"I want my room to be Willow-friendly" Tara-New Moon Rising

"She's my everything"
Willow-Tough Love

[urnofosiris]

I really wish Joss Whedon or any of the 'I am not a homophobe but' people would read this thread and like maybe get a teeny tiny clue as to what being gay means or what the consequences can be before claiming to know what we need or should feel like. It is not just a hostile society some people have to worry about, when you are gay/lesbian/bi/trans it can be your very own bloodkin and friends, who are, or should be, the very ones that ought to love and support you.



Amy, that was a wonderful post, it is nice to read how things can and should be. I can relate to your fears and misgivings about coming out. I may not be gay, but being a FtM the part about coming out, accepting yourself, the general fears of the consequences and reactions because of who you are, are very much akin -if not the same- I think.

Quote:

---

Yet the shame of being discovered was so great that I chose never to speak of my personal life. I chose to keep my deepest feelings of love and desire secret and hidden.

---

That about sums it up for me. I am getting better at talking and sharing my feelings, though I will never go Oprah on anyone . I have the Kitten and the people here (sapping right back at ya Xita ) to thank for that. It really helps to read about other people's experciences, the good ones and the bad ones. So thanks to everyone.

Tara: "uh Willow?"

Willow: "No dancing naked, huh?...It just won't be the same."

Tara: "That's all right, we can save it for later" ----From Wilderness, the newest WT comic written by Amber Benson and Christopher Golden

Edited by: DrG at: 7/31/02 12:29:05 am

[Sheridan]

Quote:

---

I really wish Joss Whedon or any of the 'I am not a homophobe but' people would read this thread and like maybe get a teeny tiny clue as to what being gay means or what the consequences can be before claiming to know what we need or should feel like

---

It's a shame we can't make this thread into a file, then whenever we get some troll coming in to the board we could just e-mail it to them.

Willow: ...I have to tell you....

Tara: No, I understand you have to be with the
person you l-love

Willow: I am

[emma peel]

I think you have a good idea about saving this thread to a file, Sheridan, however, I wish we could take DrG's suggestion a bit further. I wish we could just make copies of this thread and start mailing it out to the folks who should really read it,I.e.JW,MN (I don't know if it would do any good with those two, though), FOX,UPN, the suits.The Media. Everybody.Let them know that they have been dealing with real people and real lives, and that JW and Company should take responsibility for his actions.

End of rant.

Janice

[Californakate]

hi i donty post often i prefer reading what everybody else thinks and the fics which i know annoys some people for some reason but there we go.

i felt i had to post now cos im 15 and gay pretty much lets say im 85% sure but im not straight lets say that.

so i came out to my sister like a month ago now that was scary!!!! i could even say it! i left her a note (her idea) and she was totally cool. she thinks its a "novelty kinda" and "cool" so i was sooooo happy obviously.

when it comes to parents however im petrified!! crap my pants, starin down the barrell of a gun, end of the world scared. but your words of encouragement have really inspired me that everything will be ok. im still scare stiff but i have hope which is more than i did.

the other side of some peoples stories whose families have disowned them do however put me back were i was. i cant stand the thought of not talking to my family, ok i dont like them sometimes but u know at least i have them and i love them soooo much. them thinking that im discusting is even more scary than the thought of telling them.

this is why im not gonna tell them for a while (like at least 5 years). or when i have a g/f.

im not ashamed of being who i am and i kinda like being gay but at the moment the idea of not having a family to spend xmas with etc brings tears to my eyes.



Kate

[Epicurus]

Reading the posts in this thread actually gave me chest pain.

Let me start by saying I know exactly 2 gay people personally… my aunts. I’ve read stories of the horrible things that happen individuals in the GBLT community so I am aware of the fact the families disown their own child or siblings or parents when they found out said person is gay… BUT I’ve never known anyone who had to go though this.



I was scared to tell my parents that I was gay but I always knew they wouldn’t disown me because we’ve had open discussions about my aunts and homosexuality in general.

I mean, it’s not like it didn’t cross my mind… I wasn’t sure if the fact that their own child was gay would be “a whole different ballgame” ya know?

Turned out I was lucky.

Sure, they’re in somewhat of a denial phase. They are still getting used to their new found knowledge (as am I so I can’t really hold it against them). At least they are trying to make an effort make sure they let me know they love me and just want to see me happy.



I can’t imagine how I’d handle being put in the types of situations that some kittens here are living with. These stories really break my heart because even though I don’t know any of you personally you are all real people who share a common bond with me. Your stories aren’t a headline in a newspaper or an exploit shown on television. This is even more real to me and it’s disturbing.

I feel bad for anyone that has to go though that much pain and I hope each of you have enough courage to be strong and overcome whatever bullshit these supposed “loved ones” throw your way.

"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance
and conscientious stupidity."
- Martin Luther King, Jr.

[Arwen]

As mentioned above, this may be in the wrong thread, but I didn't know where else to go, and I'm feeling a

little desperate.



I haven't really been disowned persay, but I think a situation I've been going through has made it worse. I was raped and assaulted a few months ago, and soon after found out I was pregnant. According to certain family member it never would have happened if I wasn't gay. I resent that beyond anything. I wish I hadn't told them about what happened, because even though I know it isn't true it hurts beyond words that they'd say that. This morning I had to have a D&C because I lost the baby, the doctor said most likely fron stress, but it could have been anything. I had to go through today alone, because it was just too much for them. I don't think I've ever felt so alone or hurt in my whole life. I feel like I want to curl up into a little ball and hide in a cave forever. I recognize that I'm depressed, and in pain because I lost the baby. As warped as it may sound, it felt like it was the only good thing that came out of it all and I was actually excited, and now it's gone too.



I wish people could feel differently about these things. I wish they weren't so prejudice. Do they even know how incredibly lonely it makes you feel?

[thrilledbymaclay]

Arwen-

My heart just broke reading your story... No human being should have to go through that much with a strong familial support system, let alone by themselves with the associated feelings of isolation. By the way, your feelings about your pregnancy aren't warped in the least, in my opinion. Though I can't imagine what you're going through, please know that my thoughts are with you. Kittens, from what I've seen, are always willing to lend strength to each other when needed- You have a family here. If you need to talk, please e-mail me: maclayrosenberg@hotmail.com

[BytrSuite]

Yes, Arwen, you have a family of kittens here for you. You're not alone.



I'm sorry you went through all of that. I'm sorry that you're feeling alone while trying to deal with it. Please email me if you want to talk bytrsuite@kittenboard.com.

————––

It's the first time that you held my hand
It's the smell and the taste and the fear and the thrill

It's everything I understand /
And all the things I never will

[Amymlc]

Oh my God! I am soooo sorry Arwen. I got goose bumps and actually cried reading your story. That's just so horrible. How could anyone say that? Being raped was not your fault in any way shape or form. That is so sick that someone would tell you that you were raped because you were gay. Whoever said that is a moron and needs a good dose of humanity. I still don't know what to say about that...how could someone say that to anyone who has been through something so horrible? Even if it was because you were gay (which it WASN'T) that still wouldn't make it anything you could control...it would have been because of some stupid ignorant bastard like the person who said that to you.

[La]

Arwen, you are so not alone. You have each and every one of the kittens behind you. And we're all here for you if you need us. Please feel free to email me as well if you want another person to talk to: lasahana@hotmail.com - or if you have MSN or AOL i'm on both as lasahana.

~La



Our bodies are on loan from chaos; the integrity of our selves is but a fleeting moment between womb and tomb.

~David Gordon White

[Hanki]

first off *mucho hugs* go to all the kitties who posted in here and secondly i'm so sorry arwen.



i guess this is the right place for my post, it's not so much that i've been disowned by my family but my fear of being disowned by my family. i'm only 15 and i've known i'm a dyke for about two years now (god bless willow and tara ) i'm out to all my friends at school and they are all perfectly fine with it... with the possible exception of one person who i think is more than a little homophobic but she's getting better.



i'm not out to my parents cuz i'm scared that my mother will go insane about it, i think she's very homophobic cuz anytime i watch/read/talk about anything with gay things in she seems to find a reason to yell at me. i just bought Tipping The Velvet and when i'd read it she wanted to read it "to know what the fuss was about" and it seemed that as she got further into the book she got in a worse mood with me, like it was my fault the characters are having sex or something!



my father on to the other hand is fine with it, he often says to me that he doesn't care about anyone's preference as long as they're happy. honestly i think he probably suspects the truth and that's his way of saying he'd be ok with it.



just realised that there wasn't really any point to that but at least i got it off my chest i'm gonna join in with the IM if you ever wanna talk thing cuz its always great to talk to kitties

on yahoo: hanki182

msn: han_da_punk@msn.com

thanks kitties, you guys rock!

~ Han ~
"...cuz i shove a hanki down my trousers..." ~ Rachael Stirling

[Janie]

Arwen, sweetie, I'm so sorry. All I can say is be sure you surround yourself with people who love you as you are, and know that people here like me are thinking about you.

[wannabebad2]

Hi All-

Unfortunately families can be difficult in excepting certain things. When I told my mom she asked me what she did wrong. How could something like this happen to HER child. About 6 months or so after I was dating my first girlfriend, she got very angry and kicked me out for being gay. I slept in my truck a couple of nights and snuck into my girlfriends house for a few others. Then she called me and asked me to move back in. I guess not having me around was enough to make her think about what she was doing, why she was doing it, and see it was crazy. She has finally accepted it and is actually very supportive. There is always hope. Or maybe I was just lucky. I leave it to you guys to decide.

[Kalita]

My thoughts go to you as well, Arwen. That anyone could leave you in the lurch in that situation, let alone make such a stupid and hateful statement as that, just makes my heart break.



Nobody deserves to be the victim of such an act, no matter what or who they are. That you found some hope in the situation was a ray of light, and I'm equally saddened that it, too, is gone.



It is my wish that you may find some path that will, somehow, bring you some closure and hope. There are many people that can help, both here online and in your area. Find someone to talk to that will listen and understand. It can be an enormous help.

"...you can make those two characters as dewey-eyed in love and it would never be too much."

-Chris Golden, on W/T

[ChaoticBliss]

everyone knows about my orientation except for my family.



about 6 or so years ago my mom and i were watching trash tv... i can't remember if it was jerry springer, ricki lake or jenny jones... and the topic of discussion was about gay relationships. anyway, my mother bluntly told me that it would break her heart if i were to ever turn out that way, and that it would be the only reason why she'd disown me or any of my brothers.



being bi-sexual is hard enough as it is without having to hide it from family... we get shit from both the gay and straight communities. it hurts having to lie to about who you're in love with, and it isn't fair to either parties.



despite the fact that i'm getting married next year, i still feel compelled to tell my parents about my bi-sexuality. should i tell them after the wedding? would it even be relevant anymore? arrrrrrrrgh. decisions decisions.

-------------

"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use." - Kierkegaard

[Ginner WTluv]

I just wanted to say that my thoughts are with all of you and i hope things get better for you soon.

I guess i'm one of the lucky ones. My family has never really had a problem with me being gay. I remember what i was first coming to terms with it (it hit me pretty bad, i went through a whole denile stage), i was terrifed that my parents would disown me, even though deep down i new that they wouldn't. At first i didn't really understand why i felt the way i did for girls. I thought it was wrong and that i wasn't normal. But i managed to come to terms with it and now i realise that being gay is part of who i am and i'm totally fine with that. I'm no different to anyone else just being i like girls. I don't think i would have been able to come to terms with it so easy if it hadn't been for the kitten and Willow's and Tara's relationship. (Willow has always been my favourite character and when she and Tara got together, it kind of made me realise that being gay was okay). I found the kitten board while i was going through a pretty tough time. I suffer from depression and, at the time, it was really bad. I was confused about who i was and the worry that my parents would disown me if they ever found out was overwhelming. But i found this place, around 2 years ago now, and being able to talk to everyone here has helped me more than anyone can imagine. So i thank you all for that, especially xita for creating the kitten. And now, 2 years on, the depression is getting better, i'm happy with who i am and am in love with the person i want to spend the rest of my life with.

Once again, hearing some of you're stories really broke my heart and i'm so sorry for you. My thoughts are with you all.



~ Jen

I'd like to take a moment to talk about something that's happened lately. I'm also in love. It's a very special thing and I'm really rather proud of it. Yes, I'm in love with my own breasts. I feel no personal shame about this; in fact, I think this is the one. It's going to last. ~ Ruth

[Arwen]

Thank you all for your warm wishes and kind thoughts, it really means a great deal to me. This board is always so kind, and amazing. Just when you think no one in the world cares about you, you all prove it wrong.



I've been thinking about leaving, not here, but where I live. There's a lot of bad memories here now, and I'm not so sure I want to surround myself with the 'supportive' people I have in my personal life. I was trying to look at this analytically, and see if there was a lesson somewhere. There wasn't really, other than maybe that I'm stronger than I thought I was, or at least I hope I am, and I shouldn't let things that hurt or scare me hold me back. There are many things I want to do in my life, and I guess now that there's no baby I can so some of the things I thought maybe I couldn't before. I just feel so confused, and of course hurt, it's hard to move on. The urge to disappear off the face of the earth is almost overwhelming, but I don't know if I'm doing it for selfish reasons or not. I just wish I had someone with me here, to see things more clearly than I can I guess. I don't know. I'm rambling now. I guess in the end I wish I could just make it all go away.

[technopagan78]

I've been reading this thread with terrible sorrow, considerable astonishment and no small amount of awe in learning about so many people's bravery. Han, Kate and all the other teens who've posted, at 15 or so, you're already amazing people: smart and caring and filled with empathy and a knowledge of the world that part of me wishes you did not have. Just think what you'll be like in five or six years. Awesome people each and every one of you.



Arwen and Lisa, the ill treatment you've suffered cannot be excused or forgotten. You are both incredibly precious, would that your families recognized you for what you are. I cannot imagine how frightening it must feel, but please know that you are not alone. I imagine that both of you will be held in the hearts of many for a long time to come.



Even though I've read so may difficult coming out stories, tonight, having read them I wish now more than ever that I'd had the courage to come out when I was young. While I came out to my brother when I was in college, and my sister, more or less has put it all together, I'm still closeted to my parents, and now we are all far too old, I feel, to have that sort of discussion. I fancy that my parents have their own ideas about me, but we do not speak of my personal life very much. Instead we talk of career and books and such things. Since we live 1000s of miles apart and I only see them once or twice a year, this situation works well, up to a point. For now I wish that my parents truly knew me. I could come out to them now, but what would be the point. The damage seems no small repair.



I realize the price many of you have paid has been high, beyond imagine. But you made an important step that I did not and so good for you. The trials so many of you have faced are unfair and beyond excuse. You have brought shame to no one, although it would appear many in your lives have behaved shamefully.



To Arwen and Lisa and GavfromIHJ, and everyone else, take loving care of yourselves, you deserve no less, and a great deal more.



And, a special note to Xita and Theatremouse, you've given me a great deal to think about, thank you



Technopagan



P.S. Arwen, I just caught your second post. Sweetheart, you have a place in this world. It may take a little time to find it, but you will in time. I know that it is cold comfort, but things will get better.

[Iamyouknowyours]

My heart goes out to you all. Bless you Arwen, I can't even imagine going through what you went through. I'm so sorry, and I hope you will have happier times ahead. If ANYONE needs someone to talk to, please feel free to email me eltonsgod@aol.com. I am so grateful that the kitten board is there to provide a place for people in need.

Sex always leads to bad things on Buffy. Angel turned evil, Willow turned evil, Tara got shot, Buffy ended up dating Riley...

[Pipsqueak]

Well, I haven't been disowned or anything, but this seems to be the thread to bitch about your family, so here goes.



For Thanksgiving weekend, my parents and I drove up to Blacksburg, VA to see the UVA/Virginia Tech football game. Two of my uncles (my mom's brothers) live in VA, and so they went to the game with us, and we all spent the weekend together. My uncles are fun people to hang out with, and I've always liked them. But they -- and my mom -- grew up in the country in a VERY conservative area. (For that matter, so did my dad). Anyway, we're getting ready to go out to eat breakfast on Sunday morning, and one of my uncles asks if anyone has seen the TV show Six Feet Under. He starts talking about how there are two guys, one gay and one straight, and "they've started focusing too much on the gay guy". Then he complains about how the gay guy has a "significant other, or whatever you call them" (said in a very disparaging tone) who is black, and they recently showed a kiss between the two men. My other uncle -- and to my utter astonishment, my MOM -- chime in with "Oh how disgusting!" and "Why do they have to show that crap on TV?" and "Those damn Hollywood people are always trying to push the limits." I felt sick. And now I almost feel sicker because I didn't say anything; I just stood there and let them spew their bigoted crap.



Later on we were at Denny's, and they go off on black people. How blacks always complain that everything is so offensive, like the Rebel flag and Little Black Sambo (and I don't even know what that is but my uncles were apparently upset about it), and Black Pride stuff is stupid, and "they say they want equal rights but what they really want are special rights!", and again I just had to sit there in disbelief, feeling shocked that I was even related to these people.



And I kinda feel weird complaining about this, because I'm not black or gay. (I had a bit of a sexual identity crisis in the past year, but have come to realize that it's okay to be straight and still think that women are hot. Cause, um, hello, they are.) But what if I were gay? Or if I started dating a black guy? Would they think it was disgusting, or be ashamed of me, or ever speak to me again? And it makes me wonder if they even qualify as "family". I mean, if a little thing like that would cause them to think less of me, do I want these people in my life? I dunno. It was just a depressing weekend. I had never seen that side of my uncles or my mom before, and it was kind of a letdown.



It also made me appreciate what a lot of you go through. I started thinking about what would happen if I was gay and had to come out to them. Or if we actually lived near my uncles and I heard this stuff all the time, and was forced to stay in the closet so no one would find out.



My dad, though, bless his heart, never said a peep. Once upon a time he would have; he's really conservative too. But this time he changed the subject. He even told a really nice story about a black lady who works in his building, when they were all ranting about Black Pride. I think I love my dad. I mentioned something to him one time about the lesbian cliche, and how offensive it was. I wonder if he thinks I might be gay. Heh. Anyway, that's my Thanksgiving Day Rant. We're going back up to VA for Christmas to visit my mom's family; I'm sure I'll have lots more stories to tell.

"Skin mags! Skin mags!" -- Amber Benson

[Vampivy]

Pipsqueak, I’m sorry to hear about your Thanksgiving Holiday. I myself was put in a similar situation about 10 years ago.



Okay so I’m sitting at the dinner table with my dad and my stepmom (at the time) on one side and my cousin and her husband on the other. Here I am stuck at the head of the table and my stepmom starts about how earlier on some talk show she observed some gay and lesbian teens trying to come out to their parents. She goes off about how it’s disgusting, wrong and being oh so high and mighty, god fearing and all, she adds “there all going to hell”. My father then chimes in to agree with her. Which floored the hell out of me. Keep in mind I’m on one of my rare visits to my dad’s house after my parents divorce, and I barely started to peek out of the closet.

So back to the dinner from hell. My cousin comes in to defend these teenager’s my stepmom spoke of to say "what business is it of ours to judge them." Feeling some relief that the conversation didn’t get uglier, I couldn’t help but to drift off to my own thoughts of disappointment. Because here’s my dad one of the few people I had planned to come out to someday personally. I just didn’t want him to find out from someone else. And he’s agreeing to such hateful things in regards to gays and lesbians. I wanted to just lay my head down and cry. I felt so bad cause I too didn’t say a word through out that hideous conversation.



Years later on one of my dads rare visits to my home he confronted my mother about rumors that I was a lesbian. I had come out to her about three years earlier, so no shock to her. She was great about it. A little disappointed that I didn’t trust in her to tell her sooner. I was seventeen when I came out to mom and I came out officially when I was fourteen to someone else first.

So anyways mom tried in vain to calm him down. He cries and says stuff like “Not my daughter, she not like that”. Did I mention I’m not that far away in another room half asleep wandering who the hell is making all that noise.

Well mom tells me she sat him down and told him “You’re a grown man, you’re her father and no matter what she’s your daughter. You have no choice but to except her and love her, so deal with it cause I did.”

Later in the day I get up showered and dressed and head to the living room where my dad sits on the couch looking bummed out. He tells me he has to go back home and he wanted to say goodbye. I thought nothing of it and I walked him to the door he hugs me and says he’s sorry as he begins to cry a little. I’m thinking, well this is new. Goodbyes were never this emotional before, but I thought nothing of it. Remember I'm still oblivious to the conversation he had with my mom earlier.

He says “I love you and I’ll talk you soon”, and he leaves. My dad and I never discussed my sexuality one on one. We actually don’t speak at all, but for totally different reasons.



I consider myself lucky because the mental list I made of all the people I wanted to come out to personally took it very well. I’ve been blessed in that sense. But I will always have that fear in the back of my mind that when the rest of the world and my family finds out, that they wont be as understating. I don’t hide who I am, but I also don’t wear it like a badge. I’m just me.



Patty

[Patches]

When I was 13 or so playing ‘house’ with my best friend took on a slightly different meaning. We sort of moved from you be ‘mommy’ and I’ll be ‘daddy’ to (ahem) practicing the things that ‘mommy’ and ‘daddy’ did – so we’d be ‘ready’ for when we were older and got married. I didn’t know what a lesbian was, I didn’t understand the whole concept of sex – but at some point we crossed from make believe to make out. I guess we’d gotten really carried away one day and forgot to lock her bedroom door. Knock-Knock and in walks her dad. It was kinda hard to explain what we were doing in bed, with most of our clothes off, especially when he’d spent a good chunk of time listening at the door.



He told her mother, grandmother, and my mother and our church youth group, and the parents of all our other friends and likely half our teachers as well. The resounding “YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOURSELVES” he bellowed at us really stuck. We weren’t allowed to be alone together, anywhere, our bedroom doors had to be left wide open, we weren’t allowed sleep-over nights anymore, in the summer we had to get changed separately into our bathing suits – it was a major humiliation. That, however, didn’t get me disowned. Since I was a year and a half younger than she was, she was the bad influence, I was just young and impressionable (but I knew what a clitoral orgasm felt like long before I knew what it was called (blush). After the lecture(ssssss) on the evils of ‘homosexuality’ and it just being a “phase”, I ended up a frightened, ashamed little baby dyke and crawled into the closet and stayed there until I was 30. Then the proverbial sh*t hit the fan and I woke up to the inevitable – I was gay and there was no getting around it. It was come out or jump off a bridge - I decided coming out was preferable (at least marginally) to dying.



I moved back to my home city, with bright hopes, identity, ideas and my new baby dyke badge of pride on my clothing. Things were great until my job contract wasn’t renewed and I ran out of money; mom said “move home” and I did. Gay rights were big in the news and she kept commenting (positively) about them, and her friend’s son who was gay and all the other people whose kids she knew were gay – so bolstered by this, I came out to her – expecting she’d be okay with it. Well, her approach was it was okay for other people’s kids to be gay, but not hers. Within two weeks, I was a friend’s couch away from the street – she’d called my friends and told them to tell me not to come home – she “no longer had a daughter.” Ouch in a major way, but I learned to live with her choice; it was her loss, not mine.



She passed away several years ago but I did get to see her before she died, and I hope we finally found peace. Although she couldn’t speak, she squeezed my hand as I talked to her and I took solace in her unwillingness to let my hand go until she fell into a sleep, a sleep from which she never awakened.



There is, I believe, an end to bitterness. To everyone who has had family reject you because you’re gay, remember you choose your friends, you don’t choose your family and sometimes, even the most bitter (and man, did my mother ever re-define bitter) people come around. I hope everyone is able to find peace with family. If you can’t, if they won’t accept you, they are the ones who lose, but don’t shut the door on them forever; you never know what might happen.



Hang in there, it does get better and after a while the pain is just a dull ache, then a twinge and sometimes it goes away altogether - surround yourself with people who love you for who you are, not who they want you to be.