Teachers: In or Out?

[masterjendu]

Hiya Kittens,

I would like to solicit stories, anecdotes, opinions, etc. regarding your experience as or with LGBT teachers. If you are a teacher, are you out to your students/co-workers? Additionally, if you are a student, are any of your teachers out? What have been the repercussions? If you are neither a teacher nor a student, and just wanna weigh in, please do.

I have just returned from teaching for 5 years in Korea where gay people DO NOT EXIST (at least officially). I am now pursuing an ed. after degree in Alberta, the neo-conservative capital of Canada : ) and am hoping to get an idea of what LGBT teachers face. It seems obvious to me that a homosexual/trans teacher could be an inspiration to students, but that is a wonderful theory that might not actually hold up in practice for most people!

So, if you feel like sharing any of your experiences (positive, negative, or indifferent) as or with GLBT teachers, I would be very appreciative.

Thanks,
Jen

P.S. I apologise if this subject has already been broached. I looked for something like it but to no avail.

[jay/wt4evr]

Well, that doesn't count a lot in teachers meaning, but here in Italy we have a trans {Vladimir Luxuria} at the Parliament and she's well accepted as politician and such I don't know about teachers though sorry hope you'll be fine

[JujuDeRoussie]

Hello,

This topic is interesting. It is something I think is very hard to be. Out as a teacher I mean. Why? Well, because not every body is tolerant, and besides the insults a teacher could meet, there are also some.. humiliating things, the non respect of the teacher's authority, and the many complains bigot parents can do and such.
So it is all of this that makes it hard for a person in such a position to be out. I think.

As for my experience, well when in primary School or Middle School I can't think of a teacher that was gay. Maybe there was one, but he/she hadn't "Homo" written on the face.

In high school it is different. I have been in three high school.
In the first one, the English Teacher (who was an asshole) was a walking cliché... But I haven't been in his class long enough to know if he was indeed gay. There was my Art teacher that might be lesbian. I did hope for some weeks that she was, she was really large with the butch. But she never mentioned anything, I just know she was single. (my way of asking if she was single? I asked about a ring she wore, which was a medieval ring for engagement, but she said she just liked the design and was single).
In my second High School, there was two gay persons. One Teacher (a bastard by the way, but good teacher), and a counselor of education. The French teacher wasn't exactly out, but he lived with a man, an "housemate". For who knew him, he was gay, for everybody actually he waS. Everybody knew. But he never said anything to the students and kept saying his partner was his housemate (as his partner did, he was a teacher in a middle school). The counselor was an open lesbian. It was ard for her at time to be out because her job needed authority, which wasn't always respected. Being a woman didn't help either, but she managed and has respect of most of people; and that this high school was in the middle of nowhere, with more bigots than countable... (the French Teacher has als the misfortune to be an arab, and in this high school racism and homophoby was high).

As for my last High School, None of my teach was gay, they were almost all married with person of the other sex or engaged. None was single. But thinking of the size of the High School and the open minded of most of the people there, I think that a teacher being gay wouldn't have minded being open.

In college.. Well it is so anonymous... I did wish many times that one teacher in Authors of Sociology was lesbian, but she wasn't. *sighs*

Anyway, I hope this is what you were asking for.

I know no out teachers, but I know closeted and why.

Friendly,

Julia.

[PolarBear]

At (junior) high school there was one teacher who everybody thought to be gay, but even today I'm not really sure if he was or not. At least he wasn't out to his students. He just had this little feminine stereotypic gay-man presence and that's why most people though he was gay. People respected him at class and he was a good teacher, but on the other hand many people (including me, sometimes...but hey, I was fourteen and stupid) joked about him behind his back. Though I think that joking was never very serious.

[Zooeys_Bridge]

Funny enough, both of my favourite high school teachers are gay. Neither of them were open about it, but didn't exactly hide it either. The first was my english teacher and wasn't a 'stereotypical' gay man, he just retired recently, and he's come to my house for dinner a few times. It was only a few months ago he actually admitted he had a partner, and tried to convince him to come to dinner next time

The other got me to come to the school I'm at, which has a pretty open campus in terms of sexuality(and everything else too). She's never made any mention of her partner, but my gut is telling me. There are things that just make me 98% sure you have to pick up because you know her.

And a third teacher I had who was openly gay was just the nicest guy and blase about it. He was a little more flaboyant, made mention of his partner a few times(was co-runner of the Gay/Straight Alliance with the Teacher #2 I mentioned), crappy teacher, but no one really cared.

I don't know about other schools in the country, but I live in a pretty liberal area, 6 miles from Philadelphia in South Jersey. So just keep in mind socio-policial-cultural aspects about location I suppose.

..but teaching in Korea? Five years? Yowza, how did you get into that? Sounds really interesting, I'm curious, any good stories?

[Guest]

Interestingly, gay people do not officially exist in Mauritius as well. I have never personally come across a GLBT teacher who could have been accepted in the educational system whether it be public or private. The rhetoric returns us to the idea of promoting a culture of inner naturalness that follows the same cycle. The country’s conservative attitude prevails in the form of religious dominance and it becomes difficult to integrate teacher gay role models who could have had an impact on impressionable youngsters.

[umgaynow]

Well, when I was in school coming out just wasn't done, especially for faculty...in high school 1978-1982 there were a few teachers that everyone knew were queer, pretty much an open secret, but nobody cared one way or the other.

Oddly enough, a few years after I graduated my friends and I went to a gay bar in Ogunquit, ME and our waiter was my 12th grade homeroom teacher...I couldn't help smirking, because as a teacher he was really rather a prick...kind of a prissy Felix Unger from The Odd Couple kind of queen...also in retrospect he was rather more unpleasant to the gay kids...typical scared closet case

[opengirl]

Well now, this is interesting. I am a teacher living in the capitol of Canada, who also spent some time teaching in Korea (where gay people do not exist!)... talk about coincidence.

Presently I am not teaching full time, I'm supplying at a preschool (which is practically keeping me employed full time) and I am out to my fellow teachers, which is fine. Not to my students though... just because they are preschoolers and it would be beyond their understanding I think. Besides, I don't think they'd care... kids are by nature self-centered, and so the personal lives of their teachers are not very interesting.

I'm actually planning to head back to Korea in September... I had a good time there once I found out where all the lesbians hang. For a country with no gay people (officially), they've got a pretty swinging gay scene.

Anyway, just my two cents.

[CrazyTaraWitch]

I've only had one gay teacher that I know of, and she wasn't open, I think at the request of the principal. I think most parents knew, but as elementary students most of us were oblivious, though I remember wondering come about 5th grade. It wasn't till I few years later, when I got to know her parent's daughter that her sexuality was confirmed. All the students really liked her, and I don't think it would have made a difference to us if she had been out, but my dad told me that some of the parents who knew or suspected she was a lesbian thought it was inappropriate to have a gay teacher, but thankfully to my knowledge they never did anything about it. For myself I wish she had been open, because when I came out I had never met an open lesbian, and even if I'd never talked to her about being gay, I think just knowing she was there, living a happy normal life no less, would have been a comfort to me. But at the same time, I understand why she kept her sexuality a secret, especially with the younger kids. Teachers face a difficult situation because they work with so many different people, and have not only their coworkers to face, but also students and parents.

[masterjendu]

Thank you so much for your responses, everyone. It is especially wonderful to get such a global perspective.

It would seem the consensus is that most teachers who are gay are not, shall we say ‘loud and proud’. And I would guess that this is mostly because of self preservation; you never know how someone will react. Although things seem to be shifting as there is definitely a trend of more openness (coinciding with the societal trend) from umgaynow’s high school days (where “coming out just wasn’t done”) to those of Zooeys_Bridge (with the existence of Gay/Straight Alliances).

If only we could all be like kindergarteners who are just figuring out what genders are let alone the rules of gender and sexuality roles. And just imagine if those youngins were exposed to ‘alternative’ lifestyles as something completely within the norm of the human experience; how open would the high school students and parents of the next generation be!

I would love nothing more than to be the kind of teacher who can inspire respect for all (especially oneself), so here’s hoping for some pride and luck in my near future.

Thanks again, kittens!
Jen

P.S. One minor clarification: Ottawa, Canada’s capitol city is not neo-conservative. I was referring to the province of Alberta as ‘the neo-conservative capital of Canada’. Just making sure you all know where the neo-cons are hangin'! : )

[nicola]

This is a really interesting thread. I'm currently training to be a secondary school teacher. I'm not out to my colleagues or the students, not even to my course mates. Tonight when asked about how my love life was going I even said "I'm putting it on hold till I finish the coures" !

Its strange cause in my head I don't really have a problem with people knowing or talking about my sexuality, I'm out to my family and oldest friends. But with people associated with school and with new people generally now, I seem only to feel comfertable if people ask me straight up (ahem) are you gay/bi? etc and I answer honestly, however of course people are much to polite/PC to ask like that anyway!

I don't know if its cause of working in this education environment and the self preservation thing, or just cause I'm training and am just wanting to keep my head down and get through it. but I seem to be terrified of offering information about myself, I'm even changng pronouns when talking about my ex! I feel ridiculous and I'm sure everyone knows or suspects anyway, but I can't quit it. My coursemates would be fine with me, my dept would be cool. I teach modules on homophobia and gay culture and at least one of my mentors is out to colleagues. I recently changed flatmates, one has many gay friends, yet still I keep it to myself.

Part of it I think is cause I haven't had a girlfriend in over 3 years and I have hardly any gay friends, I don't go out on the scene, I don't date, I dont even watch the L word! I say nothing because there is nothing to say. I'm embarressed to be open, because there is nothing really in my
life for me to be open about about. I feel slightly ashamed than I am re-closeting myself. When I had a girlfriend I talked about her all the time. It was an easy way to outing yourself, you just throw it into the conversation. When your single, outing yourself is not as casual.

So am rambling now. I think that it is important for education professionals to be out, but its more important for them to promote gay-friendly culture within their classrooms. I would like to be out, but I guess I'm not ready. However I do think when I taught the modules on LGBT issues recently, I felt like it was one of the most important things I can do as a teacher. Yeah my class management skills arent too top notch at the moment, yeah some of the activities sucked and and and.... but I know if as a teenager I had seen teachers deliver lessons that treated gay people in straight forward, matter of fact, non sensational, non judgemental way. This would have changed my life. Like Tara and WIllow, it would have offered at least a little more balanced version, that maybe it was ok, maybe you can be happy, maybe there is more people like you out there than you think. Times have changed for my students, they won't be as completely in the dark as I was. but to hear balanced views from an authority figure, this is still so important and so needed. I think this is one of the most important things I and other teachers can do, wether we feel able to be open about ourselves.

N x

[Dorothy]

none of my teatchrs are officially out :s
but one of them makes ANYONES gaydar go
BEEEEEEEEEEPBEEPBEEPBEEPBEEEEEEP *meltdown, overload!*
I´m not that much into stereotypes but he just can´t be straight, there's absolutely no way he can be

[Zodiax]

Interesting (: Just my 2 cents.

I reckon I have the most homophobic semi-private school in the whole of Brisbane Australia. We have a total of 2 out gay people, and they've been gay bashed many many many times, which is probably the reason why all the closeted ones don't come out. Being a catholic school, our head of religion is extremely, extremely homophobic and downright annoying ( He denies it but still....) My english teacher is an avid pro-gay supporter and she's been rumoured to be lesbian because she's kinda sorta butchy and single without any children and the fact that she supports LGBT people. While i don't know if she actually is curvy, I honestly don't care. She is the only person who is considerate to LGBT individuals and takes note of the struggles they go through. Whenever someone says Fag, Faggot or some anti-gay insult or offensive term, she doesn't lose it, but sends them straight to the Responsible Thinking Centre aka School Hour Detention. Although my gaydar does beep when I see her, she's awesome and i reckon that's about all that matters.

[Sandman78]

My partner is a first grade teacher, she's out to the entire faculty, but not to her students or their parents. We are not ashamed in any way of our lifestyle we just felt it was none of their [students & parents] business who she loves or lives with. It was a mutual decision between us that it would be easier not having to explain (or defend) year after year her sexual orientation to them. She's happy the way things are, she said she doesn't have anything to prove to a bunch of 7 year olds. As for her co-workers, she has great relationships with a lot of the them and not one has ever said anything negative or derogatory towards her, they are truly accepting of her, and of us ( they even threw us a baby shower and go gaga over Lilly everytime I bring her by to see Mommy at school). She is comfortable there and does't feel threatend at all to be out, she is in a good school with great teachers who are very caring and understanding and accept her for who she is, a great teacher & friend.
I hope this doesn't offend anyone with our decision to keep closet towards the students/parents...we are proud, just not loud.

[xita]

Out teachers, certainly an interesting concept to me.

First thing, advice to my fellow teachers. CHECK YOUR CONTRACT! One of the first things that I did was check out my contract and it's expressly written that I cannot be fired for my sexual orientation. Of course, I work in California for the second largest district in the country, LAUSD. If you plan to be out be sure it won't cost you your job or you could be in for a legal fight.

And it is 2 issues, especially with younger kids, out to the staff and out to the kids/parents. I am quite out to my staff. They were so supportive they threw a party for me and my partner when we became domestic partners. I don't hide my gayness (rainbow sticker on my car).

I am not out to the kids, I teach little ones and I know it's not my place to have that discussion with them. I don't make up things though. I don't tell them I have a boyfriend or that I am married. They can think whatever they want. Recently, I did out myself to a parent and that went really well. I am sure that some parents discuss my sexuality. If they really have a problem with it, I am sure they are requesting other teachers. Luckily, most people either don't know or don't care.

A lot of my superiors are gay, I have another out teacher at my school. A lot of the district administrators are gay. It is also my understanding that at the middle schools and high school the teachers are more out to the kids. I don't think there's a school around here that doesn't have out teachers. My school is rather small and we have 2. The issue in my district is quite open. I am happy to be working here. I wonder how gay marriage in California might further this issue even more.

Growing up (80s), I didn't have gay teachers. Or at least I thought so. I met a kid in college and it turned out we were in middle school together. He told me all about the gay teachers at the school, turns out he was quite out already. I also remember reading about 5 years ago about this teacher who ran an alternative school for gay kids here in LA and I recognized him as my middle school ESL teacher. It was so exciting. It kinda thrilled me. I'd love to know the truth cause you know a lot of the teachers had to be gay.

I think I wanted to add that it wasn't all easy and that for years I was the only gay teacher on my staff and that I was quite closeted for a long time and only my close friends on the staff knew. I am still paranoid about the parents mounting some protest at some point because of my sexuality. I know that things have def gotten better in the years I've been teaching. It seems like less and less of an issue. But it's still not one of the best jobs to be out at.

[Willowtree252]

I think I wanted to add that it wasn't all easy and that for years I was the only gay teacher on my staff and that I was quite closeted for a long time and only my close friends on the staff knew. I am still paranoid about the parents mounting some protest at some point because of my sexuality. I know that things have def gotten better in the years I've been teaching. It seems like less and less of an issue. But it's still not one of the best jobs to be out at.

I am not a teacher but I do work for the Cy fair ISD a very large district I am a school bus driver and I am very careful who I tell. I refuse to hide it I wont shout it but that last part that I quoted that is where I am at now in my career be it but don't speak it. I was told point blank don't ask don't tell they may not come right out and say you fired because your gay but they will find something because no one is perfect its a very sad thing. I am very good at my job and proud of it but I am also proud of who I am.

[Giftofamber]

When I was in school, I never asked if any of my teachers were gay/straight, and I never really thought about it either. What did that have to do with learning after all?

From the other side, I'm out to most of my coworkers, but not to students or the parents. IMO, that's asking for trouble, especially since my contract includes a morality clause. A few of my coworkers are also LGBT because I've seen them in the bars, but I would never tell any of the students/parents/faculty that. It's none of my business after all.

[tazraven]

I did my student teaching this past semester and got a job halfway through it. I work in a very small county in Georgia, a very conservative state. I live in Athens, but I work in a place where everyone knows everyone and students don't belive in evolution. The school I work at is an alternative high school, and there's really only 5 other teachers I work with. That being said, it took me about a month to gauge them and figure out if I wanted to tell my colleagues my fiance was a woman.

I was in an odd situation, because I knew my commitment ceremony was coming up in December, and since I'd be working with these people through that, it would have been hard for me to keep my mouth shut. I don't think that there's anything about my life that I need to be out about, except for the fact that I hate not using pronouns. Coming out to the few people I work with was difficult, and to be honest I only told the three I knew wouldn't mind. I'm sort of hoping the other two already know and just don't care.

While I believe that a teacher should have the right to be whatever they want, it's just not possible in the place I am. High schoolers may need a role model like me, but I can't do that for them. Georgia, and the county where I teach, is just too conservative for an out teacher. Maybe they wouldn't care, maybe they would laugh it out. All I know is that I can get fired for moral turpitude, and in this county, they can define that as being gay. I hate it, but I live with it, just as I'm sure many other teachers do.

Any other questions you have, I'll be glad to talk with you.

~Sara

[BadAssKnitter]

I teach in the very conservative state of Virginia. Not in Richmond or Northern Virginia or even the Tidewater. Nope, rural, small town, largely fundamentalist Christian Virginia where it is perfectly acceptable to pray around the flagpole in front of the school on National Prayer Day. Am I out at work? Not on a bet.
Do I deny who I am? No, I just don't advertise it . . . well, I do wear a rainbow earring if anyone cares to notice. I figure the kids might figure that one out eventually.

I have recently changed jobs and will be teaching at my daughter's high school in the fall. Her friends all know so it will be interesting to see what happens there. In my old job, I was good friends with a teacher who is gay. He thinks he is hiding it, though I have to laugh at that because he is a delightfully swishy man, but because he was married and has children, no one questions anything. They have basically done the same thing with me. All my co-workers know I have a roommate, but sure I do. It is hard to make ends meet when you live on a teacher's salary and have kids to support. Straight people, in general I think, see what they expect to see. Maybe we all do that. It's a pretty human characteristic.

I hate not being able to introduce Diane as my partner. Hate it. But guess what, we can't get married or share insurance or anything else either. I can't jeopardize our livelihood at this point. Talk to me after I am tenured

I will add this as well, I know a teacher in the county who has taught for 38 years. I pegged her as gay the minute I met her. So, it did not come as a surprise to find out she has a longtime partner. She is not out to the school community though I am sure most people "know." It isn't our co-workers or even administration we fear. It's the parents. The parents of our lovely students could have our jobs in a heartbeat because school systems will bend over backward to support parents rather than teachers. It's a sad state of affairs, but it is the reality here and probably in a lot of places.

BAK

[Millerchip77]

I am currently working on a PhD looking at the experiences of LGBT teachers in the UK. I find your observations really interesting. One of the things I have noticed in my research is that more and more young people are coming out at school in the UK but gay teachers feel so unsupported and misunderstood by collegues that they are unable to offer the support so vitally needed in many cases. BAK - your expriences are horrible - it is shameful that in the 21st century LGBT people are still forced, out of fears for their own safety, to hide away or lie about who they are.

The worst story I have been told in my research is of a woman who works in rural England. She is unable to be open at work to colleagues (except selectively) or to pupils about her sexuality. The male PE teachers (I think it's Phys. Ed. in American ) brought in a pair of white shorts and told her that they were going to dye them pink. When she asked why they told her that it was a spare kit to be worn by boys who had forgotten their own kit. When she asked why it was pink they told her 'because it's a gay colour', therefore male pupils won't want to wear it. This is the same school where Afro-Carribean workmen were racially abused by pupils - when challenged on this parents were up in arms because they couldn't understand whay racially abusing people was unacceptable.

Education is vital but I think that education needs to engage meaningfully with identity issues. This is too often, in the UK anyway, dealt with in a very tokenistic way. In the UK LGBT people have near equality with heterosexual and bilogically gendered people - there is still a lot of hate though. Laws don't change people's hearts - education can.

There is a lot of work to be done. Anyway - rant over (for now). If anyone is interested I am the secretary of an international feminist association for gender and education if you want the web address please message me.

Here's a big gay wave from the UK

[Willowtree252]

I am totally with you on this I took a job this week for year round pay but so cant come out at. I have to hide look like good old divorced mom. while having a lovely wife at home. As the man sat behind the desk telling me about party's at his house for me and my husband , dinner out with the group I felt sick. I have been ill ever since in a funk because I am proud of my love I should be able to shout it. At the school district they all knew I was gay it just was a don't say it allowed this guy would lead me to gallows if he figured it out. Helping with Teaching and driving the bus the parents are so the ones to fear. Even Megan is starting to come around to us how can she not after seeing her mom happy for the first time in her life. Sandi is a doll on all this she is so supportive and understanding. What a woman she is I am blessed but she shouldn't have to be dammit. In the school district My name change and ring on my finger would be a slap on the back and congratulation. Oh well we have time to decided but the point is I should not be held to a different standered then Heteros.

[Millerchip77]

It makes me really angry Willowtree. In the UK we can register our relationships in a legally recognised 'Civil Partnership', me and my girl are doing it this summer. This grants us near equality with heterosexual marriage, we are, however, not allowed to call it marriage. As a feminist I'm fine with that - marriage has too many religous and ownership connotations for me. However I know of one lesbian woman who is a teacher and had a civil partnership. The head of her school announced it thus kind of outing her. However she was made to feel so uncomfortable about this that she has told the kids that she got married to a man. Her partner has an ambiguously gendered name so this is possible. She is scared of what parents will say.

All too often we are forced to lead two different lives - more so in the US I guess because your human rights as LGBT people are not met by the current (hateful) administration.

[Willowtree252]

I will stay at this job till school starts and then go back to the school district. At least there I dont have to keep who I am as quite and my lover a deep secret I love her to much for that. My respect for her and us must come first the thought of hiding her so deep made me to ill for words now I feel more relaxed and we will have a joyous life a head with her at myside. Sandi support for me in all of this is immeasurable she only wants my happiness !!!The hell with homophobic bastards.

[Guest]

Basically, I'm an on-field worker but in our scheme of duties, we are also designated to act as Educators on child rights in schools. I wished to share my experiences while working in two religious educational institutions whose population was majorly of muslim faith. One aspect of our programme related to the issue of sexual diversity as a human right and it is interesting to note how cultural indoctrination can be an even more powerful set-up in the education of generationally transmitted values. This indoctrination is paradoxically accountable to a far more powerful means of curbing discriminatory behaviour as there is a guarantee that homosexuality does not exist in these particular schools (as shall the same blind spot phenomenon remain in society); this version being shared by both students and the staff.

As an afterthought, I am reminded of several discussions I have had on my gay identity with a friend of mine who is of muslim faith. Though there is thorough acceptance of the person I am as a friend of hers, she always tries to integrate the knowledge of my sexual orientation (and to understand how I might feel) in terms of what her religion preaches. We were faced with the same attitude in the schools. Being gay for both parents and teachers comes across as a choice: you either abide by tradition or you are not fit to follow your religion; religion coming across as the hallmark for quality education. At least, as per local level. However, what I did appreciate was how a few of these teenagers purported that gay discrimination would not be an issue as Allah is against discrimination. Religious roots might be strong but hope still prevails.

Vi'

[masterjendu]

It has been nearly two years since I started this thread and I just wanted to check in to thank all of you who have contributed and to give a bit of an update.

I completed my teaching degree in December and am now working in a High School for the public school system in Edmonton, Alberta. I am out to my students and I am very happy to report that there has been no back-lash as of yet. I know that I am taking a risk but it (currently) seems entirely worth it to me! I'll let you know if that changes!!

Thanks again,
Jen

[Zooeys_Bridge]

Thanks for the update, Jen! Hearty congratulations on your newfound teacherly success! I have no doubts that your students adore you. Keep us posted, and I hope everything goes well.

[Guest]

Indeed Jen The path of authenticity serves the one that uses it well. I wish you the very best in your teaching career. And love.

Vi'